Ignorance is not an excuse.
Some people will never understand how I feel about this issue and why I feel that way. Big Bang VIPers need to stop making excuses for racism. By ignoring it, they are keeping the cycle going and quite frankly, have NO RIGHT to cry racism when acts are committed against them.
Here’s an blog post by the metropolitician(Michael Hurt):
“Black Culture, Not Black People”
Some Koreans were surprised to hear that many Americans, upon seeing the Bubble Sisters on television,
were absolutely horrified. Blackface is arguably the most offensive and painful symbol of racism in American history.It is painful even to watch in American history classes, and it is definitely one thing Americans never joke about. Americans generally have a pretty liberal sense of humor, but no one laughs when one is shown images of the black “pickaninny” smiling and dancing for white folks. It is a remnant of post-slavery discriminatory culture, when Blacks could not look a white man in the eye without fear of being attacked, and one could disappear in the night, never to be seen alive again. For Koreans who don’t know, blackface in America is associated with racism, hatred, and the legacy of slavery. Old television shows and cartoons showing blackface are never shown in public anymore; it’s not illegal – it’s just that no one wants to see it. It’s simply not funny.
“I have to understand that Korean people’s prejudices about Black people and others with dark skin come mostly out of ignorance, not a history of hatred.”
So when I was standing in a Chungmuro photo store last month waiting for negatives to be developed, I was shocked to see four young women performing the Weather Sisters’ song “It’s Raining Men” in blackface. I have seen a lot of things in my life, but I was standing with my mouth open, in utter disbelief.
Now I have lived in Korea for a long time as a Black man, and speak Korean well enough to talk with people and get a feeling for the culture. I know that there are not many Black people in Korea, and that much of what Korean people think they know about Blacks come from mostly negative images in American movies and television. I understand that most Korean people have never talked to a Black person, even though many people think they know what Black people must be like. I have to understand that Korean people’s prejudices about Black people and others with dark skin come mostly out of ignorance, not a history of exploitation, fear, and hatred.
I even have an understanding heart when I sometimes see a Black man with a Korean woman on a subway and every single person on the train stares at them, and young girls laugh and even point. Even though dark-skinned people, especially Black people, live less-than-human lives here in Korea (even as those with white skin are nearly figures of worship), I can understand Korean people and society enough to know that these reactions are largely the results of not knowing any better.
I’ve lived in Korea for more than three years in total, having worked as a Fulbright in Korean middle schools in Chejudo, focusing on Korean Studies in graduate school, then returning to study more of the language, and staying here this time to finish my dissertation research, and work with Korean kids in alternative schools. I have Korean friends, family, and was even able to endure the anti-Americanism of recent months. Even though I have friends, men and women, who were regularly verbally assaulted, prevented from going in some stores and restaurants, and I know of a few people who were even hit just for looking like an American, I had an understanding heart about the matter. I know Korean history and recent frustrations with Bush and the American government. Even though I and most young people voted for Gore and don’t think at all highly of Bush and our conservative government, I understood why many Koreans wanted to lash out at me and people like me, even though I did not think it fair to blame individuals for the actions of their government. I certainly hope that Russians and Filipinos don’t blame Korean tourists for the fact that many of these women have been tricked and forced into prostitution, and that their governments have asked the Korean government to alter the E6 “entertainment” visa, which was a thin disguise for importing cheaper sex workers for Korean cabarets, nightclubs, and other establishments. Of course many Korean people are nor even aware, nor are they responsible for their government’s tacit support of exploitation of other country’s women. And they should not be harrassed, spit upon, or physically attacked, no matter how angry Russian or Filipino people might become. So even though I was disappointed to hear about such things happening to Americans here – something not at all reported in the Korean media – I was able to be understanding.
But as I watched the Bubble Sisters video that day, I seriously questioned why I even bothered to be here. I really questioned how such a horrible emblem of hatred could find itself onto Korean television. Even though most Koreans are unaware of the history of blackface, surely those responsible for creating the look could not have been. The images were not just people putting on dark makeup and trying to look more like black people, as I saw Roora do in the 1990s, but it was blackface done PERFECTLY.
It was not accidental – it required someone to research these images, downloading pictures, printing them, and then using them to create the makeup and hairstyles. All of the old images were there, including the “pickaninny”, who is the chubby character with little sections of hair sticking out from all over the head. The red lips, dramatic looks of silly surprise or happiness, and the childish pajama costumes were all elements of the “minstrel shows” of the early 1900s. It is absolutely impossible for those who researched these images to not have known that these images are considered to be the absolute lowest expression of racism in American history.
These images are not easy to find; you have to know what you’re looking for, and once you find these images, they are usually a part of books and articles about the mistakes of racist Hollywood images and the history of American discrimination. For the person/people researching the topic, feigning ignorance is like trying to say that someone trying to find a recipe for kimchee on the internet, who then reproduces the look and taste of it perfectly, did not happen to notice that it is a Korean dish. “Oh, it’s Korean? I didn’t see that.” Then how did you get the asian cabbage, 고추가루, and 쩟? It’s not very plausible.
One can’t really blame the performers themselves. I have heard the story about how the girls were told that they were ugly, and despite their talent, would not be able to succeed without a gimmick.
“Ugly” Korean women – The Bubble Sisters sans blackfaceThis makes sense, since I see so many untalented singers on M-Net who simply have no singing talent and have obviously done or given something to someone in order to be there. I know that this is a society in which appearance counts above all else for women; it makes sense that this is also the country that has, if I am not mistaken, the highest rate of plastic surgery per capita in the world. But you can’t blame the women who take the surgery option to get a job, or a man, or an opportunity to sing on television. You have to look at the society that in general values women more for their bodies than their minds. So in this context, the blackface gimmick makes a certain amount of perverse sense.
But unfortunately that makes the present situation more ironic, since this makes a subtle link between blackness and ugliness. “If the Bubble Sisters are too ugly to show their true face in public, no matter how talented they are, then why not just make them look like black people? Wouldn’t that be funny?” Unfortunately, few Americans would. And I would bet my firstborn that no black American would. But again, look around. Do you see any black people here?
Have you ever wondered why there are almost none, besides the few soldiers that are sent here, largely against their will? (Korea, I am told by members of the military, is the absolute bottom of the list request for newly recruited soldiers, partially because of the real military threat and also because it is known for being a very unfriendly place to GI’s). Well, as MBC reported last month, although it is something that I already knew – Korean hagwons won’t accept black instructors, no matter how qualified they are. Why, you ask? The answer’s easy. Because we all know that moms across the country want the best possible instruction for their kids, so if they see a black instructor, they may assume that the person is less qualified. Which hagwon would you send your kid to – the one with the tall white man who looks like those people you see on TV, or the black man who might be qualified, but first we have to see his qualifications, resumes, references, etc. He just doesn’t “look” as smart. From the hagwon owner’s perspective, it’s not his or her fault – they’ve got a business to run, no? They’re not discriminating, but just responding to reality. It’s funny that this is what real estate agents in America have always said when they refused to take black customers who wanted to move into white neighborhoods, or restaurant owners who would not allow blacks to eat there, or black children to go to schools with whites. “I’m not racist – it’s just the way things are. I can’t change that. I’d go out of business.” It’s ironic that Black Americans face the same kind of discrimination everywhere in the world, even in Korea.
“One taxi driver here I spoke with told me that he tried to make a point of picking up foreigners that night because…he had heard reports on his radio that some Americans had been beaten up.”But this isn’t new to me. Korean folks, no matter how much they claim to be culturally liberated, are very much in the thrall of American ideology, especially when it comes to race. In fact, I even think this is one of the inner conflicts that fuels recent bouts of anti-Americanism among youth. Don’t get me wrong – there are lots of reasons to resent the inconsistency and inherent selfishness of American policy towards the Koreas and the rest of the world. But that’s not the discussion I’m having right now. I’m talking about a different thing – the long-standing relationship with the United States that did not end in the 1990s, during the time of increased consumerism, longings for reconnection with a so-called “lost” past, and increasing expressions of national pride. I wasn’t here for the World Cup, and to be frank – I’m saying what few would say in public – I’m very glad I missed it. As a typical American, I don’t have much interest in soccer, and personally, not much interest in spectator sports. I respect Korean national pride, but I didn’t think that a true pride was being expressed there. It felt more like what it was – rooting for the home team, disguised as proud nationalism. I understand that it was fun, and I probably would have had some fun myself had I been here. But from a serious perspective, painting oneself red, cheering, praying, and even crying for the home team is simply an exaggerated love for the team. It’s a place where pride in the nation happens to overlap with who you want to win the game. It’s fun, but pretty meaningless.
“The flip side of national pride is ugly jingoism, and the line dividing the two a fragile and fickle one. “
I think superficial national pride masks a lot of things. Like the fact that many Americans I talked to – who were not sports fans – actually say they were relieved that Korea won the game, because they literally feared for their safety if America had. That sentiment was backed up in a news report online that noted that security had been doubled for the Korea-America game, and that the officers on duty that day were also relieved to not have to handle an unruly crowd. I have heard many stories from other Americans here at that time about Americans cheering for their team – or even those just simply walking around – being verbally harassed or physically assaulted. One taxi driver here I spoke with told me that he tried to make a point of picking up foreigners that night because he heard that many taxi drivers were refusing to do so, and also that he had heard reports on his radio that some Americans had been beaten up. So he simply felt to 미안해 to them and made an extra effort that night. And I’m sure there were many others like him. But had I been in Korea that night, I am sure that I would have stayed at home and watched it on TV. The flip side of national pride is ugly jingoism, and the line dividing the two a fragile and fickle one.Yet Hiddink is worshipped like a god. And I don’t use that word lightly. I do mean “worship.” When I saw Hiddink on television around two months ago, a talk show had invited him for a retrospective on his coaching and victory, and the audience was treated to the standard slow motion shots of hugging, crying, and cheering on the field. People on the street were asked to give their greetings to Hiddink, thanking him for what he had done for Korea, while girls squealed and screamed that he was their hero, men wanted to drink with him, etc. The only thought on my mind was that he was truly Korea’s perfect hero.
He was taking the place that had already been created in Korean post-war culture, but could not be occupied because of a new kind of pride that wanted to distance itself from America. But he was older, white, and reasonably good-looking. He was the new MacArthur, the great white father himself, reborn. The older generation, which is quickly dying out, has fond memories of MacArthur’s fabled landing at Incheon. Now the younger generation, a little more jaded and cynical about showing any signs of 사대주의 (the Korean historical/cultural idea of “deference to the greater”) to a so-called “big brother,” can have a new hero arriving at Incheon, although this time on a plane and not American. But he’s just as white, old, and authoritative. And he does the unexpected, taking Korea further than it ever could have gone without him, using unconventional techniques and old-fashioned wisdom. Only this time it was with a soccer ball.
But what has Hiddink really done for Korea? Before I try to address that question, I have to say something that I think all foreigners think about, but won’t say in public. Koreans worship American, and by extension, white people. OK – I’m making a broad generalization, but for the sake of discussion, I’ll just speak in generalities. The smell of the old colonial big brother/little relationship is as strong as it ever was. Did Korean women try to shape their faces and bodies along Western features before the arrival of the Americans? No. Korea has the highest concentration of fast food restaurants than I’ve ever seen, even in the United States. I’ve eaten more hamburgers in Korea than I have in my entire life in the States. People dress like white Americans (when dressing casually), listen to popular music that reproduces and follows the exact same popular genres in America, eagerly consume American popular culture, and generally live the same lifestyle that capitalist consumerism dictates. Korea has been a good “pupil” of the US, in that it is in many ways more devoutly Christian and anti-Communist that the US has been for years. What’s so independent about Korean mass culture, besides what the state and media tells the public?
I’m not trying to denigrate Hiddink. He was a great coach and helped the Korean national team immensely. But has he done more for Korea than the hundreds of thousands of dark-skinned wage laborers that so many people won’t even look in the eye on the subway? These are the people who do all the things that are too dirty and dangerous for Korean laborers. Unions have formed, wages have gone up, working conditions for Koreans have improved, and society has become highly-industrialized and information oriented. Korea has enough money now to bring in low-wage workers to do all of its dirty work. It’s an inevitable fact of capitalism and development, and the same things happened in the States, although not in such a compressed period of time. But when a white man opens his mouth and stutters out an “anyoong ha sheemneekers” in public, everyone is so happy and surprised and flattered. The white American standing on the subway usually has all kinds of people come talk to him or her during the course of the day. What of the tired brown man who gets on the subway every day and has lived in this country for ten years, speaks fluent Korean, and has worked his skin to the bone keeping the labor capacity in this country cheap and efficient? An Indian man living here is absolutely invisible. Although it’s possible to become a permanent resident or citizen, the standards in reality are kept so high that they are nearly impossible to meet. These people can’t send their kids to Korean schools, although many of these children have been born here and have never stepped foot in their parents’ country. Yet Hiddink, who has no intention of living in Korea or struggling as a member of society here is offered honorary citizenship. In fact, it’s not even simply that – it’s a special visa status designed to allow Korea to make the show that it is open to the outside. Although this image is a lie, it sometimes can be if you fit the role of Great White Father.
In this way, Korea is America’s star pupil in its worship of whiteness. Getting back to the Bubble Sisters, the one thing that this recent incident makes clear to me is the fact that Korea has related itself to Blackness in exactly the same way whites – well-intentioned or not – have in the States. Youth culture, these days, seems to love Black culture. Gangster rap, R&B, and soul styles have been stolen from Black culture ever since Seo Taiji and the Boys took its style from Cypress Hill in its fourth album, back in 1995. Well, actually, there were cases before that, but I don’t need to make a list. Turn on the TV and you can easily see young Korean “gangster” rappers mimicking and aping what they THINK black people act like and how they live, pretty girls on each arm, looking tough, sneering at the camera. The Bubble Sisters say they were praising black culture in their use of blackface. They say they had no idea it was offensive. The sad and funny this is that I actually believe them.
“Only in a culture so deeply in the thrall of whiteness, and filled with a similar animosity towards blackness, can black culture be so ignorantly insulted.”
Only in a culture so deeply in the thrall of whiteness, and filled with a similar animosity towards blackness, can black culture be so ignorantly insulted. It is precisely because Korea prefers BLACK CULTURE WITHOUT ACTUAL BLACK PEOPLE that disgraces such as the recent blackface incident is possible. It is not an innocent misunderstanding, or an honest mistake. It is a sign of the deep enmity Korea has for those it considers racially inferior. The United States has always had the exact same love-hate relationship with black people. “We love their food, music, and women. We just don’t like to be around them.” Contrary to popular belief, many white Southerners swear that they LOVE black people, and always have. As long as they “know their place.” That’s the key assumption that’s never stated. In Korea, people can say that Korea loves Black culture and people – as long as they don’t live here. This blackface incident is just a part of the general social ignorance about black people that is actually the result of an underlying, strong distaste for people with dark skin. Part of this distaste is related to the the fact that foreign assistance and short-term labor is wanted, but foreigners are not. Not in any sizable numbers, anyway.So – as I looked at the remaining signs from the World Cup days, that are getting ever harder to find as they get cleaned up and taken down, I am bemused. The signs that encouraged Korean people to smile at foreigners is the most amusing. The only time it’s important to be concerned about Korea’s treatment of foreigners is at the time when the eyes of the world are upon it, and the government and business interests are eagerly anticipaiting tourists’ money. As a foreigner who can read such signs in Korean, I feel the effort was a little cheap, a little ungenuine. Has the culture really experienced “internationalization,” or “globalization,” or any of the other fancy catch-phrases of the last ten years? Not in any significant way. Look at the irony of the World Cup. Korea tried its hardest to make a good name for itself in the eyes of the world and attract tourists to the games it had been planning for almost 7 years. I hear people talk about how international and open Korea felt during that time. But only months later, the “Fucking U.S.A.” song had been revived, 미국놈 is the word of choice at rallies and websites expressing anger at the deaths of 미선 and 효순, and Americans are being verbally and physically harassed in the streets. I read the bulletin board of antimigun.org regularly, where I had been told to go to “learn more about the 사건,” and was treated to educational and informative postings such as “I’m going to kill the next 미국놈 I see,” or the one that posted a picture of a black GI and a Korean woman merely standing in the same frame, with the caption “A traitor to her race” with people saying that this “slut” should be “executed” for sleeping with “animals.” Even after the recent demonstrations died down, at the recent anti-war rallies, I heard the word 미국놈 in several of the speeches at the rally, even though an American was one of the invited speakers. I’m glad he couldn’t speak Korean in that case. I wonder whether any Korean people mentioned the fact that he had been repeatedly insulted, even though he agreed with the cause the Koreans were fighting for.
“60 Minutes,” America’s longest-running news show, had a full segment about Korean anti-Americanism last month. Despite such horrible displays, I know truly hateful people are the minority here, and that anti-Americanism is not as serious as it appears on the surface. I was disappointed to hear about the 60 Minutes piece, not because it was inaccurate, but because Korea’s expressions of anger towards the US, many with which I agree, were doing more to hurt the country than help it. What else does the foreign press see? What can you expect of reporters, no matter how knowledgeable, who don’t live here? I had a friend planning to come visit me in May, her first trip to Asia. Along with the tensions with NK, she was concerned for her safety as an American. Despite the fact that I explained many things to her, she simply felt too uncomfortable to come. She canceled her trip, which she had been looking forward to for more than a year. This story is not unique, and many foreign tourists do not have friends trying to convince them to come to Korea.
“We know about the “ganguro” girls who darken their skin and try to make themselves look “black.” But these displays are not taken as insults as much as mere expressions of how much certain Japanese youth really like Black culture.”Displays of ignorance like the Bubble Sisters’ use of blackface simply hurt Korea. They prove the assumptions of the outside world that Koreans are close-minded and racist. They are not going to stop and think about whether or not the Bubble Sisters knew what they were doing. And it is wrong to blame the members of the group, who are talented young women I only wish the best of luck to, but without blackface. My only point is that in a truly internationalized and globalized culture, the people who should know better would simply know not to do things like this. In a country that actually had enough black people who were listened to and whose opinions were valued, this would never happen. In Japan, a country I rarely laud, hip hop groups have always made Tokyo a major stop on their world tours. Japanese fans of black music actually know something about it, to the extent that black DJ’s and performers have always included Japan as part of the black music scene. The Source, America’s monthly magazine and authority on hop hop culture, always covers the Japanese hip hop scene. We know about the “ganguro” girls who darken their skin and try to make themselves look “black.”
But these displays are not taken as insults as much as mere expressions of how much certain Japanese youth really like Black culture. Even if you don’t buy this, at the very least it is a true Japanese creation that “plays” with racial markers, that being dark skin, blonde hair, peach lipstick, etc. It’s not hip-hop, rap, or anything American. It’s undeniably – and quirkily – Japanese. As an African-American, I don’t feel insulted, but rather somewhat bemused. They seem to have their own thang going on, and it’s alright. To me, it feels more akin to a celebration of “ghetto fabulous” than a form of racial “slumming.”
That is the context within which one can argue that such emulation can be seen as a compliment. But within a culture of complete ignorance and cultural theft of Black culture here in Korea – or the flip side, being the reproduction of white racist images of black people – the Bubble Sisters’ intended “compliment” is something I can take as nothing more than an insult of the lowest and vilest degree.
But rather than excoriate the performers themselves, Korean people reading this article should take a good, honest look at the cultural attitudes and alignments that allowed such an embarrassing thing to happen. As an outsider, my perspective is the most valuable thing I can offer to people who live here. I mean this critique to be constructive; but sometimes my patience is really tested, and I wonder why I even bother. Although it may seem self-serving to say, I don’t mean this to be narcissistic: in the long run, well-meaning cultural critics such as myself are exactly the ones Korea can ill afford to lose. Hopefully the response to this incident will give me more reason to maintain the optimistim that continues to allow me to believe that Korea really intends to strive for a goal of a truly “global mind.” Because if they don’t, burned out former-allies-turned-enemies who take home only negative things to say about this country will have much more power to shape the outside world’s opinion of South Korea than any World Cup or Olympic festivals. The world is watching now, South Korea – are you ready to step up to the plate and live according to your so-far empty slogans of “globalization” and dreams of being a world leader? It’s time to walk the walk or continuing to talk the talk, as they say.
According to the comments and other sources, a performer (who’s half black) in the same company told them about the history of Blackface. There was no ignorance and they knew what they were doing. So what say you BB VIPers? What is Seungri explanation for his comments? A person who worked with Black people, performed with Black people and emulate the culture that pay his bills and put the clothes on his back, what say you?
Filed under: YG Family | 1 Comment
From my previous blog, I wrote a sacrastic statement that many have failed to get:
4. It’s called ‘Acting’. (Get a black person to act in the video)
Here’s an idea for the next Big Bang video; all the members can wear Nazi uniforms and shake their asses in front of concentration camps since you know Koreans hate Jewish people too.
The irony of this statement which makes it fitting for this new scandal to come out of Korea.
SKorean cosmetics maker to halt Nazi ad
SEOUL, South Korea (AP) — A South Korean cosmetics company said Wednesday it will halt an ad campaign with Nazi references following complaints from a leading anti-Semitism group and the Israeli Embassy in Seoul.
The Coreana Cosmetics Co. decided Tuesday to withdraw the television ad for a skin lotion to prevent further controversy, company spokesman Kim Yoon-ho said.
The ad shows a young woman in a military-style trench coat holding a soldier’s cap that appears to have the swastika-gripping eagle Nazi insignia. The version shown in previews contained the slogan: “Even Hitler didn’t have the East and West.”
Korad, the Seoul-based agency that produced the ad, said it believed a Nazi soldier and Hitler symbolized “revolution” in keeping with the lotion’s “revolutionary” moisturizing and calming effects. It said the reference to the East and West emphasized the product’s dual functions.
The cosmetics firm changed the slogan before the ad’s actual airing in February to “No one has ever had the East and West.” Kim said the revision was designed to prevent controversy.
The Los Angeles-based Simon Wiesenthal Center and the Israeli Embassy sent letters of protest to Coreana calling for the ad’s withdrawal, Kim said. Korad said it apologized to them on behalf of Coreana.
Last year, a South Korean publisher agreed to rewrite a best-selling children’s book on U.S. history after the Wiesenthal Center criticized it for containing messages that echoed Nazi propaganda. The center has previously protested uses of Nazi themes in Korean bars and nightclubs.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iAeb3CMj7YjZJ5vPKQDnN1N7ddeQD902TV7O1
See what did I tell you?
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How Coon
Happy New Year!
To start of the New Year, I will be donning “Chinky Eyes” to show my ignorance towards Asian people. Since our frequent offender, Seungri has no problems donning “Black face” in Big Bang’s music video “How Gee”, there shouldn’t be any problems with me doing something similar right?
In case you don’t know(the low I.Q. among some Big Bang fangirls) Black Face minstrel is a highly racist depiction of African Americans.
It has been a year since Seungri made that ignorant comment about Black people and YG has yet to issue an apologize. Unfortunately my campaigning efforts has fallen upon deaf ears due to YG Staff members hiding the issue.
I would love to see how Big Bang fangirls explain this. Please note you cannot use the following:
1. Rappers do it all the time. (Really?)
2. He’s just paying tribute to Jazz musicians.(Whoever thought this up is a fucking idiot.)
3. That’s not makeup; he’s really that dark (See Below)
This is Seungri’s complexion.
This is Seungri with makeup; notice the darker complexion to mesh with the wig and mustache.
4. It’s called ‘Acting’. (Get a black person to act in the video)
Here’s an idea for the next Big Bang video; all the members can wear Nazi uniforms and shake their asses in front of concentration camps since you know Koreans hate Jewish people too.
Filed under: YG Family | 5 Comments
The current issue of Audrey Magazine (Oct/Nov 07) which can be found at your local Borders and BN has printed my letter about Seungri’s Ignorant comment.
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Racist/Ignorant Checklist
Racism
Pronunciation: \ˈrā-ˌsi-zəm also -ˌshi-\
1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race
2 : racial prejudice or discrimination
— rac·ist \-sist also -shist\
Ignorant
Pronunciation:
\ˈig-n(ə-)rənt\
1 a: destitute of knowledge or education ; also : lacking knowledge or comprehension of the thing specified b: resulting from or showing lack of knowledge or intelligence
Racist/Ignorant Checklist
1. You are a racist/ignorant when you say the following words: N*, C*, W*, G*, W*, and K* etc etc etc.
No amount of spelling variations doesn’t change the origin and meaning of the word.
2. You are a racist/ignorant when you say stereotypical comments about a group of people.
Seungri a.k.a Victory of Big Bang comment’s: how in America, he probably could’ve gotten shot. Then SeungRi is thankful that it was a Caucasian and not an African American.
3. You are a racist/ignorant when you used the color of your friends skin to justify your “nonracism”.
I have many black friends, so I’m not racist.
4. You are a racist/ignorant when you agree with a racist joke, comment or action.
You are encouraging, not combating. Yes, I’m talking about SOME Big Bang fans who chose to ignore Seungri comment.
5. You are a racist/ignorant when you use “we should get rid of Black History, Affirmative Action as excuse further your argument.
The purpose of Black History is to EDUCATE and statistics shows that Affirmative Action helps WHITE WOMEN not African Americans.
6. You are a racist/ignorant when you tell a group of people to “get over it” about their past atrocity.
Those who do not learn from their past are doomed to repeat it.
7. You are a racist/ignorant when you believe the images seen/heard on TV, Radio, movies etc.
African Americans depicted as Violent or Criminals
Arabs depicted as Terriosts or crazed
Mexicans depicted as lazy or illiterate
Asians depicted as exotic or mysterious
American Indians depicted as savages
Any roles from Non white cultures depicted by white actors.
From thina:
“…..oh, and just to ‘clear up’ the comment, i say ‘black’ because my close friends who are black have told me many times “we’re not all african american”. there’s a difference between ‘black’ and the “N” word. 19 Oct 2007″
Apparently her and her “friends” have been watching too much “Boondocks”.
From mon5482:
“dont worry thina, we all know ur not racist, but we do know who’s the ignorant one…and its neither u nor seungri :X”
Yes and that would be YOU and thina if you do not think there is anything wrong with that stereotypical ignorant comment Seungri made. It also shows your true feeling towards “blacks” and “African Americans”.
Filed under: YG Family | 1 Comment
FAIL!
YGfamily.com posted a new notice on Septemeber 12, 2007 in which YG apologizes for T.O.P outfit scandal.
Why is ok for YG Entertainment to apologize for Big Bang’s T.O.P for wearing a jacket that has the Japanese imperial flag but it’s not ok for YG to apologize for Big Bang’s Seungri making ignorant sterotypical comments about Black people?
Filed under: YG Family | 9 Comments
Souvenir
Well once again racial cynicism is nurtured by people who’d proclaim themselves non-racist people who are just striking out for freedom and anti-PC behavior.
The world is doomed if you can’t feel free to make racist comments, and certainly the end is now if a person of color, especially a black person, dares to openly resent terms that have been long used to demean their race. Dilute the issue all you want, but change race to gender and let me address your mother, wife, daughter in terms nearing the offensiveness as nigger and let’s see how ’sensitive’ you get.
The larger the white audience for rap has become, the more ‘mainstream’ music, the more financially profitable and promotable it is to be a gangster rather than political. Just like there are women willing to be exploited for money in porn, there are black people willing to live out your images of black people as long as they make money from it, and folks in both groups willing to buy into the image.
Not all black people use the term, most black people despite the term and DON’T use it. Perhaps you should question your awareness of black people beyond rap imagery?
But why challenge what you need to justify your own racial attitudes? Sure listen to a small band of rappers and their audience, and decide the term is okay to call African-Americans because “they [all] use the term themselves.” Fine, and I’ll decide that all Asian look alike and are kung fu masters.
Another thread at soompi.com which discussed the issue:
LucasBunny
Mar 27 2007, 11:34 PM
Okay first and foremost
Do not Bash anyone!!!!!
I did not create this thread to bash the artist I am about to mention
I wanted to discuss this matter in the 20+ section instead of the k-pop section because I want to hear unbiased opinions on the matter.
This was like in January I think, my buddy a fellow soompier contacted me and she was very upset! It was about a comment made by a member of BigBang (Suengri)
so little Suengri goes on a korean radio show and makes a very ignorant and racist remark
he was discussing when he came to united states for the yg 10th anniversary concert
and how he went to change in someone’s van, he was talking about in america how he could have gotten shot and he’s glad the person was caucasian and not african american because the african american would have shot him.
I pull that quote out later.
I just found it weird that he would think a black person would shoot him and not a white person.
Now that upset me as well cuz #1. BigBang knows damn well they have african american fans, they looked us dead in eye at MTV and at the concert
#2. BigBang is based on hip hop and r&b, parts of the african american culture, in fact YG promotes the african american culture, they say so in there statement on the YG site.
So for him to say that was dumb.
So my soompi pal decided to write letters to the company because we were offended by this, mind you this was not to long after the Rosie incident and you know how we were treated??? Like criminals!
We were told because we are not korean our opinions don’t matter, we shouldnt have got worked up because of the reputation african americans have, we need to keep quiet before we get YG in trouble, we are not real fans and that we were trying to ruin BigBang’s careers! You would think the same people offended by Rosie’s ignorant remark and that Oscar error would understand the most. Instead of saying Suengri was wrong people made excuse for his behavior, “Oh he’s only 16, he’s a sheltered korean boy he doesnt know anything”
well if that’s the case a 16 year old boy should not be saying “Real mini cooper” in his songs.
No one hates BigBang, no one was trying to end there careers, I think they are 5 talented and goodlooking youngmen, I still enjoy there music regardless, but this needs to be mentioned!
we are just letting them know that we were hurt by Suengri’s comment, even though it was on a korean radio show, we stay updated on these things.
So another soompier is a member of the yg site, she even posted our letters up there and I know they saw them, yet no statement was released still.
It seems like since we are not korean we do not matter, I just found i strange that something similar happened in the asian community, but the african american fans of Big Bang were turned into bad guys, don’t get me wrong there are many asians on our side. But Suengri needs to apologize to his fans. Instead people are totally sweeping it under the rug like nothing happened.
Also Masta Wu was shooting out the “N” word in his latest song
and there are many people offended by that term, I am not offended by the term
but others are and I complety see why, it’s very inappropriate to say, I know many black people say it in there songs, but when people from a forgein label start saying things like that it’s bad, especially when they are trying to bring there artists out in america.
So was this ignorant of the two artists??
or were we just overreacting???
Same question with the “Rosie incident”
Once again please do not bash these artists
I don’t hate either one, I don’t believe they are racists
I just think they should think before they speak!
lilyphenix
Mar 28 2007, 12:04 AM
Well, it show again that our world isn’t perfect.
I think the problem may lie in the cultural context as well. What works in America will not necessary work in Korea. America has powerful lobbies. Even if a star, singer, actor offends someone who is not American, but his culture is represented by an important community in the States, that person will apologize because of the power sale the offended’s community represents.
Not only that, a public figure acting bad in the States is pointed at and his/her life will pretty much sucks until he/she gets his acts right, but the standards must be a little bit different in Korea, maybe the singers/actors are more protected by their companies?
I don’t know how big is the Black community in Korea. I think it would make a difference if powerful Black figures (aren’t they businessmen there?) living there or Black artists here raised their voice to address that matter. That may help open people’s mind a little bit more. Just my two cents.
rahrah
Mar 28 2007, 12:05 AM
unfortunately, a lot of Asians in Asia, their perception of blacks is what they see from Hollywood. They never see blacks otherwise.
If all you did was watch Hollywood, you would think all blacks are criminals, thugs, rapists, etc…
Just like the blacks in NYC, all they do is watch the TV, so they think Chinese deliverymen are all like William Hung, they are all weak and to be pushed around, so its okay to shoot them and killl them even after u rob them of 20 bucks. Stereotypes exist both ways, but I guess with Asians, you keep it more to yourself, while with blacks those incidents erupt in violent attacks against asians, usually unprovoked. i mean, there’s been a lot of deaths of chinese deliverymen in NYC this past year. And the thing is, they were killed after they were robbed. stereotypes of being weak and easy to pick on in this case got them killed.
yeah, of course you have a right to be mad tho. but in the end, i guess stereotypes are hard to ignore. but they do go both ways. hollywood is everywhere and influences most people to some degree, even if they don’t realize it.
JuicyFruit21
Mar 28 2007, 12:42 AM
(rahrah @ Mar 28 2007, 12:05 AM) *
unfortunately, a lot of Asians in Asia, their perception of blacks is what they see from Hollywood. They never see blacks otherwise.If all you did was watch Hollywood, you would think all blacks are criminals, thugs, rapists, etc…
Just like the blacks in NYC, all they do is watch the TV, so they think Chinese deliverymen are all like William Hung, they are all weak and to be pushed around, so its okay to shoot them and killl them even after u rob them of 20 bucks. Stereotypes exist both ways, but I guess with Asians, you keep it more to yourself, while with blacks those incidents erupt in violent attacks against asians, usually unprovoked. i mean, there’s been a lot of deaths of chinese deliverymen in NYC this past year. And the thing is, they were killed after they were robbed. stereotypes of being weak and easy to pick on in this case got them killed.
yeah, of course you have a right to be mad tho. but in the end, i guess stereotypes are hard to ignore. but they do go both ways. hollywood is everywhere and influences most people to some degree, even if they don’t realize it.
i have to agree with your post…to an extent…
blacks in NYC come into contact pretty much everyday with Asian people….and i highly doubt they are all thinking Asian men= William Hung.
and those ignorant criminals who kill the deliverymen over nothing even after they’ve robbed and taken the food..well lets just say that i hope they burn in hell. because that’s just wrong..no it’s three levels past wrong. people like that have no respect for human life…and if eveer one of them finally meets their match i hope to all hell that they get what they deserve.
now onto Hollywood. you are correct when you say that Hollywood influences the actions and thoughts of people be it conscious or sub, but most of the time it’s up to the individual to make the decision to educate themselves….especially if it directly pertains to their line of work.
in the case of Seungri, i honestly feel he made an ignorant remark, and it obviously shows that he knows very little about the culture he’s representing thru his work..it also suggested the underlying racism and xenophopia that is reflected in the closed-in society of South Korea, and other Asian countries, because apparently, it was ok for him to say.
lilyphenix pretty much said what i was going to say as well…and i agree that if the very small Black Community in SK were to speak up, there probably would have been more attention brought to it…kinda how in Japan there was a manga/magazine that depicted the Caucasian foreigners (teachers, gov. workers, soldiers..and just normal citizens) as rapists, muggers, theives, and liars and woman stealers( and they encouraged the Japanese men to take action against them). now there may have been some who fit the description, but these magazines were very popular among the Japanese men, causing the foreign men to be treated very wrongly. they (the foreign men) spoke up about it demanding that these stop being published and they were (not that easily, but it happened) and i just think that is really cool..because if they hadn’t i’m sure that mindset would have festered into something really nasty.
as for M.Wu….i didn’t like him saying the N word….and the fact that he knows American culture and how wrong it would be for him to say that if he were here, just made me disgusted. i honestly have no feelings good or bad about him (i was never really into his music..the only time i heard him rap was like on other artists’ songs..lol) and well…that cannot be excused as ignorance….but the truth of it is…i kinda get the feeling that he was using the word as a way to be more…”down” if you will…to be more..”black” but in honesty..it just highlighted how ”not black or down” he was…..which if you think about it…makes it even worse..lol his song would’ve been just fine if he’d have left that word out..buuuutt he chose to keep it in.
~~~~~~~
to ash..i’ve said this to you before, but i honestly don’t think there will be a formal apology or statement that acknowledges our efforts and concerns anytime soon….well atleast not until Se7en makes his debut,because i kinda feel that the powers that be would be really embarrassed by the US hip hop/r&b community and media if it came to light that they ignored Seungri’s slip-up and right now, they aren’t thinking about that…when they should…. remember, it’s all about business. they’ll release a statement only if it means they may lose money over it. and since right now, people are still buying their albums, then guess what…
*quick thought*
if they do release a statement after so long, i think it will make them look worse….because then it will seem like they are just trying to save face and that they don’t really mean it…because the apology would just be empty.
theedqueen
Mar 28 2007, 12:42 AM
Well, if they made an ignorant remark, that’s one thing. The majority of Koreans (or any other asian country for that matter) most likely don’t have much exposure to black people other than what they get from hollywood. But then again when the issue deals with who you think would be more likely to shoot you, then it can get pretty racist since you’re judging the morality of a group of people instead of an individual person and that’s just not right. To think someone would pull a gun on you just because of their race is just really wrong and can’t be ignored instead of something more pardonable like thinking if you’re asian you must be super good in school.
Now, as for the response from YG entertainment I find that really insulting. If you insult anybody you should apologize to them, not accuse them of ruining your career. Especially just because they are not fans from your country. People are people, borderlines shouldn’t be a factor in common decency. If you’re ignorant about the whole situation fine, annoying, but fine. But if someone points it out to you at least own up to it.
jurassic5
Mar 28 2007, 12:46 AM
it’s very ironic and ignorant of them…
this is the same label that claims to be Korea’s source of urban music…so i find it ironic of YG to have an artist of theirs express that sentiment towards the black community in the united states, considering that these same artists try and emulate a part of this community by way of dress, style, talk, music etc.
some other things the company has done that i found ironic:
posing with guns in music videos and album covers…the irony? korea has very strict gun laws..virtually making guns non-existent in korea
groups such as StonySkunk talk about the wonders of marijuana…the irony? weed is considered a narcotic in korea which leads to imprisonment
HERMIT
Mar 28 2007, 12:47 AM
(LucasBunny @ Mar 27 2007, 08:34 PM) *
So was this ignorant of the two artists??
I’m not familiar with the incident, so I’m only going by your account above by how it went down. But it does sound to me that there was a measurable level of ignorance by the two. In the case of the 16 year old, I’d gather a bit of youthful naivete must have come into play as well. I guess there’s something to be said about how the portrayal of African Americans translates overseas in countries where the presence of black culture/population is miniscule or non-existent and all that there is to go by are the depictions and representations by the different forms of media. It ultimately gives a skewed perspective. So presuming that the level of ignorance by the two artists only extends as far as their young age and presumably limited knowledge of black culture, then perhaps more of the frustration should focus on the company and the way they handled and brushed aside your concerns. Certainly, you would think that the powers that be would be a little bit more worldly and cognizant of racial sensitivities – but for them, it’s a business and money defines their bottom line. And for them, the way to meeting that bottom line is catering to where they’ll make the majority of their revenue – and that’s mostly through the Korean public first and then the rest of their Asian fan base second. Unfortunately, it would seem that everyone else falls a distant third. So, regrettably, to them they may recognize that there is a segment of African American fans, but not enough in the grand scheme of things that they would so much as raise a fuss over the complaint.
I guess my explanation may not make you feel any better, but it might perhaps pose the underlying reasons why they would state that “since you aren’t Korean, you don’t matter”. I’m not making excuses for them, but this is something to consider in that the company’s statement might not wholly be rooted in just plain bigotry but just out of the simple notion that African Americans are just not a big concern in their overall business plan. Nonetheless, I do agree that the business handlers acting on behalf of the artists should have been more sensitive, handled the issue better, and utilized a better choice of words in replying to your concerns.
or were we just overreacting???
Nope, not at all. I approach your situation the same way sexual harrasment is handled in the workplace in general: even if you don’t construe an action as harrassing or offensive, so long as somebody takes umbrage with it – you need to take it seriously and respectfully address the matter appropriately.
rahrah
Mar 28 2007, 12:57 AM
(JuicyFruit21 @ Mar 27 2007, 09:42 PM) *
and those ignorant criminals who kill the deliverymen over nothing even after they’ve robbed and taken the food..well lets just say that i hope they burn in hell. because that’s just wrong..no it’s three levels past wrong. people like that have no respect for human life…and if eveer one of them finally meets their match i hope to all hell that they get what they deserve.
well the thing is that its pretty easy for them. chinese live in chinatown ghettoes, blacks live in black ghettoes. they don’t necessarily interact in a meaningful way every day. NYC is pretty segregated of course.
but its not that hard to figure out what they are thinking. they are thinking asians are easy targets, won’t complain, and anyways, the tv hates them. why else do u think all your black friends think u are so weird for liking asian music? to them, its unnatural bc asians are just supposed to be quiet nerds. and some blacks (not all) who also think asians are easy targets for robbing when they deliver chinese food.
anyone looking on any asian forum will see numerous news articles about chinese deliverymen being killed in NYC in black ghettoes. you can’t deny that the stereotypes exist that asians are supposed to be easy targets.
i dunno, the guy is 16 years old tho. but the statistics do show that violent crime on asians is similiar between blacks and whites. but if he was in NYC when he said that, and heard about all the chinese deliverymen beign killed for 20 bucks, i wouldn’t blame a 16 year old for thinking that.
LucasBunny
Mar 28 2007, 01:12 AM
(rahrah @ Mar 27 2007, 10:57 PM) *
well the thing is that its pretty easy for them. chinese live in chinatown ghettoes, blacks live in black ghettoes. they don’t necessarily interact in a meaningful way every day. NYC is pretty segregated of course.but its not that hard to figure out what they are thinking. they are thinking asians are easy targets, won’t complain, and anyways, the tv hates them. why else do u think all your black friends think u are so weird for liking asian music? to them, its unnatural bc asians are just supposed to be quiet nerds. and some blacks (not all) who also think asians are easy targets for robbing when they deliver chinese food.
anyone looking on any asian forum will see numerous news articles about chinese deliverymen being killed in NYC in black ghettoes. they are supposed to be easy targets.
i dunno, the guy is 16 years old tho. but the statistics do show that violent crime on asians is similiar between blacks and whites. but if he was in NYC when he said that, and heard about all the chinese deliverymen beign killed for 20 bucks, i wouldn’t blame a 16 year old for thinking that.
He was in California when he said that.
But he shouldnt have blurted that out on a show where he can be heard
when he knows that he has african american fans.
It was very inappropriate
and about his age.
Why do people make excuses for his behavior because of his age??
Suengri is not a baby nor is he an idiot.
I remember soompiers where saying bad things about those two little
white supremacist girls, and they are younger than Suengri
but there age didnt matter, why is it different with Suengri?
But since people bring his age into this,
we are his elders, so we want him to understand the mistake he made so he doesnt make it again, but we were labled as bad guys.
rahrah
Mar 28 2007, 01:28 AM
(LucasBunny @ Mar 27 2007, 10:12 PM) *
He was in California when he said that.But he shouldnt have blurted that out on a show where he can be heard
when he knows that he has african american fans.It was very inappropriate
and about his age.Why do people make excuses for his behavior because of his age??
Suengri is not a baby nor is he an idiot.I remember soompiers where saying bad things about those two little
white supremacist girls, and they are younger than Suengri
but there age didnt matter, why is it different with Suengri?But since people bring his age into this,
we are his elders, so we want him to understand the mistake he made so he doesnt make it again, but we were labled as bad guys.
well then that is pretty messed up. his management is just trying to protect the guy. even tho ice cube did release his song about “Black Korea” that was pretty racist and helped stroke sentiments that led to the 1992 Riots, he did apologize afterwards, but only after Korean grocers banded together and threatened to stop carrying a liquor brand that paid Ice Cube. The only reason he apologized was because of money he might lose.
if u feel that bad about it, then the only way is to do the same thing. but the management could have easily just had him write you guys to apologize. i’d blame the management more than him for the way it was handled bc it does seem like it was handled poorly.
as for those 12 year old white supremacist girls, i blame their parents more than them.
and you know what i wrote about NYC is correct tho. where was he changing tho? was it in NYC? its kind of hard for me to believe u expect others to admit all these wrong doings when u can’t admit yourself the stereotypes that exist in NYC too.
JuicyFruit21
Mar 28 2007, 01:32 AM
**ash i think he was in Korea when he made that remark…and he was in Cali..or NY when the whole van thing happened….
(rahrah @ Mar 28 2007, 12:57 AM) *
well the thing is that its pretty easy for them. chinese live in chinatown ghettoes, blacks live in black ghettoes. they don’t necessarily interact in a meaningful way every day. NYC is pretty segregated of course.but its not that hard to figure out what they are thinking. they are thinking asians are easy targets, won’t complain, and anyways, the tv hates them. why else do u think all your black friends think u are so weird for liking asian music? to them, its unnatural bc asians are just supposed to be quiet nerds. and some blacks (not all) who also think asians are easy targets for robbing when they deliver chinese food.
anyone looking on any asian forum will see numerous news articles about chinese deliverymen being killed in NYC in black ghettoes. you can’t deny that the stereotypes exist that asians are supposed to be easy targets.
i dunno, the guy is 16 years old tho. but the statistics do show that violent crime on asians is similiar between blacks and whites. but if he was in NYC when he said that, and heard about all the chinese deliverymen beign killed for 20 bucks, i wouldn’t blame a 16 year old for thinking that.
…..they don’t think i’m weird for listening to it because it’s Asian…they think it’s weird because they think i don’t understand it…but when they find out that i can speak enough korean to know what i’m listening to…they actually think it’s pretty cool..and they wanna listen too. also, many of my black friends are bi and trilingual. so it’s more of a surprise when they find me listening (because they only hear me speak english….they even freaked out when they overheard me speaking spanish..lol)
nobody is denying they stereotypes against asians (and of course on an asian forum you’ll see tons and tons of articles highlighting the wrong doings of any race other than asians..against asians….because well…face it. to some asians, this helps fuel the whole ”we are better” mentality that some have.
the same if you go onto a black forum. you’ll mainly see all the evils done by other races. same as on a white forum..its human nature.
as for him being in NYC and saying that..that’s just ridiculous. because he’s met black ppl before (his choreographer is black) so for him to say that upon going back to Korea..is kinda like wtf?
i could see if he’d met a violent black person to back up his stereotype..then i would say well he’s only going by what he knows..but he’s not..he’s going by what he hears..which is pretty dumb if you ask me….
[ramble] i remember once in high school there was this Chinese kid (who was from Puerto Rico) and we were all talking about how bizarre it was that he was Chinese, but technically he was Puerto Rican and he made a comment about how he’s glad he wasn’t from China because they chop up the stray cats on the streets and feed them to us (these were his words) and one Chinese girl in our group asked him had he ever seen it..his answer no. she asked did he know anybody personally who did it..his answer no. and she pretty much embarrassed the hell out of him for believing that bullshit and honestly it made him look like a real ass…..because this is only stuff he heard while growing up in PR and when he moved to NY he got his feelings hurt…haha [/ramble]
LucasBunny
Mar 28 2007, 01:37 AM
(rahrah @ Mar 27 2007, 11:28 PM) *
well then that is pretty messed up. his management is just trying to protect the guy. even tho ice cube did release his song about “Black Korea” that was pretty racist and helped stroke sentiments that led to the 1992 Riots, he did apologize afterwards, but only after Korean grocers banded together and threatened to stop carrying a liquor brand that paid Ice Cube. The only reason he apologized was because of money he might lose.if u feel that bad about it, then the only way is to do the same thing. but the management could have easily just had him write you guys to apologize. i’d blame the management more than him for the way it was handled bc it does seem like it was handled poorly.
as for those 12 year old white supremacist girls, i blame their parents more than them.
and you know what i wrote about NYC is correct tho. where was he changing tho? was it in NYC? its kind of hard for me to believe u expect others to admit all these wrong doings when u can’t admit yourself the stereotypes that exist in NYC too.
My bad he was in korea when he said that
but he was in California when he was changing his clothing in that van.
I never said these stereotypes don’t exist in NYC, I live in NYC
I live in the ghetto, so I know.
But I’m not denying anything that goes on there.
But remember all black people are not like that and it’s not just black people pulling triggers.
Hispanics, white, even asians do it as well
and all parts of new york are not like that either.
But with other ethnicities, especially white peope (no offense) the wrong they do gets swept under the rug
look how many white men run around america raping females and molesting children, look how many white police officers get away with murder for the wrong reasons.
But people always jump the gun on black people.
rahrah
Mar 28 2007, 01:46 AM
(JuicyFruit21 @ Mar 27 2007, 10:32 PM) *
**ash i think he was in Korea when he made that remark…and he was in Cali..or NY when the whole van thing happened….unsure.gif
…..they don’t think i’m weird for listening to it because it’s Asian…they think it’s weird because they think i don’t understand it…but when they find out that i can speak enough korean to know what i’m listening to…they actually think it’s pretty cool..and they wanna listen too. also, many of my black friends are bi and trilingual. so it’s more of a surprise when they find me listening (because they only hear me speak english….they even freaked out when they overheard me speaking spanish..lol)nobody is denying they stereotypes against asians (and of course on an asian forum you’ll see tons and tons of articles highlighting the wrong doings of any race other than asians..against asians….because well…face it. to some asians, this helps fuel the whole ”we are better” mentality that some have.
the same if you go onto a black forum. you’ll mainly see all the evils done by other races. same as on a white forum..its human nature.
as for him being in NYC and saying that..that’s just ridiculous. because he’s met black ppl before (his choreographer is black) so for him to say that upon going back to Korea..is kinda like wtf?
i could see if he’d met a violent black person to back up his stereotype..then i would say well he’s only going by what he knows..but he’s not..he’s going by what he hears..which is pretty dumb if you ask me….
[ramble] i remember once in high school there was this Chinese kid (who was from Puerto Rico) and we were all talking about how bizarre it was that he was Chinese, but technically he was Puerto Rican and he made a comment about how he’s glad he wasn’t from China because they chop up the stray cats on the streets and feed them to us (these were his words) and one Chinese girl in our group asked him had he ever seen it..his answer no. she asked did he know anybody personally who did it..his answer no. and she pretty much embarrassed the hell out of him for believing that bullshit and honestly it made him look like a real ass…..because this is only stuff he heard while growing up in PR and when he moved to NY he got his feelings hurt…haha [/ramble]
^ when a 16 year old kid in korea talks to adults, he reverts mentally back to his elementary school days out of respect. kids say the darndest things sometimes.
when i was a little kid and visited NYC with my mom, she said that we went to teh department store, i never saw a black person before, so i went up to a black lady at the counter and said ” excuse me, how come you don’t wash your face?” i just didn’t know any better as a little kid. my mom apologized profusely for me, and said she bought hella makeup from that lady just to show how much she was sorry. i get shocked every time i hear that story about myself. but yeah, i guess that really happened.
my mom handled it for me of course. in this case, his management should have handled it better.
(LucasBunny @ Mar 27 2007, 10:37 PM) *
My bad he was in korea when he said that
but he was in California when he was changing his clothing in that van.I never said these stereotypes don’t exist in NYC, I live in NYC
I live in the ghetto, so I know.But I’m not denying anything that goes on there.
But remember all black people are not like that and it’s not just black people pulling triggers.Hispanics, white, even asians do it as well
and all parts of new york are not like that either.
but its blacks killing the chinese deliverymen. you can say black on black violence is even bigger than black on asian violence, but you know that it is stereotypes that these guys have about asians that make it easier for them to target asians. thats just a fact. i really don’t think u understand how much more you hear this from nyc than anywhere else in the US (at least right now, it might be somewhere else in 2 years)
Mick
Mar 28 2007, 01:50 AM
Everyone is racist and a hypocrite. I guess I just learned to grow thick skin growing up since I’m apparently the man. People are stupid.
LucasBunny
Mar 28 2007, 02:01 AM
(Mick @ Mar 27 2007, 11:50 PM) *
Everyone is racist and a hypocrite. I guess I just learned to grow thick skin growing up since I’m apparently the man. People are stupid.
Please do not even bring that mess in this thread.
I asked not to bash.
JuicyFruit21
Mar 28 2007, 02:03 AM
(LucasBunny @ Mar 28 2007, 02:01 AM) *
Please do not even bring that mess in this thread.I asked not to bash.
i don’t think he was bashing..because it’s pretty much true..everybody at one point or another is racist and hypocritical. is it right, no, but it is life…, but i think if that person offends and gets called on it they should own up to their mistake. i think that he should have elaborated more on what he meant, but i don’t think he was bashing.
LucasBunny
Mar 28 2007, 02:07 AM
(JuicyFruit21 @ Mar 28 2007, 12:03 AM) *
i don’t think he was bashing..because it’s pretty much true..everybody at one point or another is racist and hypocritical, but i think if that person offends and gets called on it they should own up to their mistake. i think that he should have elaborated more on what he meant, but i don’t think he was bashing.
OOPPSS!
I was confused cuz all saw was “Everyone is stupid”
I think ur right so my mistake smile.gif
But yes people should own up to there mistakes
Rosie finally owned up to hers (read her blog) and people had every right to be upset
about that.
But some people seem to think that what they see in the media is a good enough excuse for racist remarks.
rahrah
Mar 28 2007, 02:23 AM
(LucasBunny @ Mar 27 2007, 11:07 PM) *
But some people seem to think that what they see in the media is a good enough excuse for racist remarks.
nah its not excusable. im just saying that stereotyping leading to bigger things goes both ways.
he’s just saying whats on his mind. he probably doesn’t even know its wrong to say that bc he really felt that way. there are other instances of korean singers who are more aware of these things overseas, I forgot who it ws, but some korean singer did a tribute to michael jackson after all that pedophile stuff went down, bc they thought it was racially motivated that michael jackson was being bashed. in the drama all in, that girl’s best friend in america was a black girl. the impression u got was that black people are friendly. because of the bubble sisters, people are more aware of stuff like this in korea and complain about it, like what happened recently in chat with beauties.
also, if u go to africa, its made for africans cus its like 99.9% african. if u go to korea, its like 99.9% korean. America is a country built on immigration (sometimes involuntary) so you can’t really apply the same standard to both and you can’t bring whats over there to here and put that on whats going on here. but on a personal emotional level, it was handled poorly. even if he got your letters, and he wanted to apologize in an email, its his management that controls everything he does publicity wise. i still think the management just handled you’re guys’ complaints poorly.
chairmanK
Mar 28 2007, 04:01 AM
I don’t know anything about the facts of this case, but based on the information that you’ve provided, I think that you’re totally justified in feeling angry about this statement by the member of BigBang. However, I would suggest that you direct most of your anger not at Seungri personally, but instead at Korean society as a whole. What Seungri said is wrong, but he only said it because his statement was acceptable in Korean society. Even my own parents, who have lived in the United States for most of my life, continue to assume that most black people are lazy, criminal, stupid, etc. As Mick pointed out, “everyone’s a little bit racist, sometimes” (Avenue Q, anyone? happy.gif). The important thing is to know enough to be ashamed when you catch yourself inadvertently making racist assumptions. Sadly, a lot of Koreans aren’t even aware that they ought to be ashamed of their own racist assumptions.
As for Masta Wu using the N-word: I think that he should be held to the same standard as black performers who use the N-word. Intent matters; the N-word is not always racist. I don’t think that the race of the speaker should make a difference in this respect. I once got into an argument with someone about whether it was racist for Quentin Tarantino to say the N-word in Pulp Fiction. The person I was arguing with thought it was plain racist; I thought that it was vulgar (the same way that the F-word is vulgar), but not racist in the context of the film.
damnalky
Mar 28 2007, 10:13 AM
I remeber reading about Seungri’s incident a while back. What he said was ignorant, but I do believe it’s truly because he’s still very young and naive, he really doesn’t know any better. You think a public figure who knows better would portrait himself as a racist on TV? You do have every right to feel angry, but you have to try to understand the fact that there are people who really just doesn’t know any better, wether it’s by choice or otherwise.
I find it very odd that YG will issue a response as such as ” you’re not korean, so your opinions doesn’t matter & you’re not even real fans”. If that’s the case, then indeed it was very rude and he should appologize. However, I don’t think YG is responsible for issuing an appology for what Seungri said, the apporpriate action would’ve been Seungri saying he’s sorry for making such an ignorant remark.
jurassic5
Mar 28 2007, 10:25 AM
(damnalky @ Mar 28 2007, 10:13 AM) *
I find it very odd that YG will issue a response as such as ” you’re not korean, so your opinions doesn’t matter & you’re not even real fans.
YG at it’s finest.
LucasBunny
Mar 28 2007, 10:44 AM
Lol I doubt that YG would issue that type of response as well
I highly doubt it.
I still love YG, but I just think they should have been released a statement like Tiffany said
if they issue it now, it’s going to seem like they don’t wanna look bad for Se7en’s debut.
I agree with u Damnalky
and thanx people for a civilized discussion
JaiNYc
Mar 28 2007, 10:51 AM
I don’t think you were overreacting. I think expressing your concerns the way you did was the right way to approach things.
I understand that there are many crimes against Asians in the US. I understand that there is still alot of negative stereotypes against Asians in the US. I understand that there isn’t a large Black community in Korea. I understand that people who grew up in Korea may be sheltered from different cultures and ethnicities. etc etc etc…
It’s still not an excuse and what’s wrong is wrong.
TrungyBoi
Mar 28 2007, 11:16 AM
(LucasBunny @ Mar 27 2007, 11:34 PM) *
So was this ignorant of the two artists??
or were we just overreacting???Same question with the “Rosie incident”
Was this ignorance? Yes, this was complete ignorance by two artists who probably had very little interaction with black Americans. Does their little interactions give them any kind of excuse? Absolutely not.
The reason why I admire black Americans is because black Americans stand up for themselves. They give themselves a voice, something that ethnicity minorities in America should do for themselves. I would like to think that if there were something said about black people that were unjust, those black people would stand up for themselves and fight this unjust stereotypical thought of blacks in America.
I said the same exact thing about Asian Americans after Rosie’s comment, and I will not turn my words backwards just because the situation is different.
clockwatcher
Mar 28 2007, 12:27 PM
Everybody likes to blame Hollywood (even though these days, there are positive portrayals of African Americans in movies and on television) but I do wonder.
Because even on this site, there are people who’ve been exposed to other cultures outside of television and still write very silly things.
And just because you’ve had little interractions with other groups, you should still use common sense and think before you talk.
I don’t think it’s an overreaction. I don’t know who these artists nor am I offended by their comments because I am aware that the world is full of racists and I prefer to ignore them but it’s definitely within your rights and natural to be pissed at them.
Lucasbunny (and anyone who can answer this):
In response to this:
QUOTE
I know many black people say it in there songs, but when people from a forgein label start saying things like that it’s bad, especially when they are trying to bring there artists out in america.
So as an African in America, we do get subject to being called the N word when used as a racial slur. I mean, if they are going to be racist and insult us, they aren’t going to ask if we are immigrants or whatever nor do they care. However, some African artists do use the word (ending with an “a”) in their songs in a positive way to mean “brother/friend” but from reading some youtube comments lol, I see some AA are offended by Africans using the term. From your experience, do you know if the general perception is that it should only be uttered by African Americans and not other black people? Sorry… I know I am kinda going OT.
orphannies
Mar 28 2007, 02:31 PM
I don’t think you were overreacting. Was it ignorant for both artists? Simply put “a big fat YES!”
But being ignorant about something is never an excuse. I don’t know who this artist is but his ignorance nor age shouldn’t be used as an excuse for his comments.
I mean c’mon if you’re making your living based off (or strongly influenced) by another’s culture (i.e. hip hop and r&B) at least show some respect for that culture. Be educated enough to know about the culture and not to make a dumb generalization like that. just my 2 cents.
mrs. pakman
Mar 28 2007, 06:15 PM
yes…i agree with most of you who already replied that it was an ignorant remark. i think that when you’re a public figure dealing with the media…you have to be very careful about what you say.
but i’m not particularly upset about what he said about black people. i feel like when you hear some ignorant statement like that, it’s an opportunity to help open up their mind a little bit by explaining why a statement like that’s wrong and that it’s extremely racist and prejudice. i’m not saying that it’s acceptable for him to go around saying stuff like that, just that this is where we can really teach someone a lesson.
what really does upset me is how the record company dealt with the situation. why are they defending the situation when it’s clearly wrong? they should have apologized and taken steps to educate themselves.
Petite_Mal
Mar 28 2007, 06:57 PM
Maybe some people will think this is overkill, but if I were you, I would send YG another letter only this time with an organization like the NAACP involved. I think that’s the best way to get official recognition. Nothing threatening or hostile, just something along the lines being disappointed with YG’s reaction (or lack of) to one of their artist’s blatantly racist remarks.
Even though this is a Korean artist speaking to Korean people, I think the NAACP would still be interested as both Suengri and YG make their money by exploiting aspects of African-American culture to the Korean public. It’s horrible, hypocritical, and very irresponsible for these “representatives” to perpetuate such negative stereotypes -relations between the two groups are somewhat strained as it is. THANK GOD not very many African Americans listen to “ni-gga” laden K-pop songs, or it’d be even worse.
Anyway, as many others have said, his comments were very, very ignorant, so I don’t think you should back down. People have also been saying that this is a time for education, but the only way for this to happen is if someone makes Seungri and YG realize how offensive those comments were. And again, I think a polite, but concerned letter, e-mail, etc. with a NAACP letterhead would be a good start.
JuicyFruit21
Mar 28 2007, 06:57 PM
(clockwatcher @ Mar 28 2007, 12:27 PM) *
Lucasbunny (and anyone who can answer this):In response to this:
So as an African in America, we do get subject to being called the N word when used as a racial slur. I mean, if they are going to be racist and insult us, they aren’t going to ask if we are immigrants or whatever nor do they care. However, some African artists do use the word (ending with an “a”) in their songs in a positive way to mean “brother/friend” but from reading some youtube comments lol, I see some AA are offended by Africans using the term. From your experience, do you know if the general perception is that it should only be uttered by African Americans and not other black people? Sorry… I know I am kinda going OT.
i’ve thought about this as well…
as for AA’s being offended by Africans using the word…i (as a black woman) find that very strange…because for one, they do not get upset when Hispanic people say it (at least here in the Bronx)..and even the Puerto Ricans and Dominicans will refer to themselves as ”Negro”..even if they are of fair complexion….one Dominican guy explained to me that its considered somewhat of a compliment..especially for women (ex: Alejandro Sans saying in Shakira’s song: ”Oye mi Negra” >>>Listen my hello kitty) what made me very confused about this is that he also told me that in DR they are very racists towards Haiti..with whom they share the island….yet dark skinned people are sought after…but only if they are Dominican..lol its weird…
anyway, like i said AAs who get offended by Africans using the word with the ‘a’ ending is bizarre…and even tho i personally feel NOBODY should say it at all, the logic of those people is kinda skewed..lol
like i said about my feelings toward the word..i guess it comes from my upbringing..i never ever heard my parents say it, my classmates didn’t say it nor did my friends at home….so when i got older and moved to a mainly white town and was literally the ONLY black female in school when i was called that (plus the ever lovely ”bit.ch”) it really was worse than somebody slapping me in my face..because i’d never seen myself as anything less than human, but being called out like that it..iono..
ever since then i’d get really pissed at ignorant people who use it in everday language because they don’t know the true meaning of the word i feel…i feel like they haven’t felt the sting that the word has when said in the context that it was invented…and i seriously think those who use the ”we’re making it into a positive” line are in denial…and that they are naive. *shrugs*
because if you think about it…you dont ever hear an asian saying those negative things to each other seriously in everyday convo…nor do you hear hispanics calling each other derogatory names in comraderie (sp?) and i’ve never once in my life heard Jewish people call each other out of their names….so…yeah. i just think it’s going to take some more time until the Black Community wakes up and realizes that we’re just shooting ourselves in the foot. lol
i also agree with mrs. pakman and the others who say that we shouldn’t be upset with Seungri…..actually we weren’t upset with him in the beginning or with YG…i think the anger came about from other people telling us rude things (like the ones Ash mentioned)…then the anger was somehow shifted from those interactions back onto YG. i also think that the way they handled the situation is rather unprofessional…because we know they’ve seen the letters (which were all respectfully written) and it seemed as tho they were ignoring our concerns. (however we did get some news months later from our Korean friend that they apologized for taking so long to acknowledge us, and they are dealing with it ”internally”) but i still feel that if the apology comes within months or weeks of Se7en’s US debut….well i would be naive to question it’s sincerity…..
chairmanK
Mar 28 2007, 10:52 PM
(JuicyFruit21 @ Mar 28 2007, 03:57 PM) *
because if you think about it…you dont ever hear an asian saying those negative things to each other seriously in everyday convo…nor do you hear hispanics calling each other derogatory names in comraderie (sp?) and i’ve never once in my life heard Jewish people call each other out of their names….so…yeah.
Some of my Jewish friends call each other by rude ethnic slurs and make ironic self-referential jokes about the “damn Jews” ruining the world. I think it depends on the sort of crowd you hang out with.
And I have one Asian friend who habitually calls me “chink” (and I also refer to him as “my chink”). But this is an unusual joke between the two of us; I agree that it’s atypical for Asians for say such things in ordinary conversation.
jurassic5
Mar 28 2007, 11:02 PM
YG probably will not make a formal apology unless provoked to…or as some have alluded, when 7 debuts here in the states and the NAACP catches wind of the incident and applies pressure to the label etc etc….
more irony concerning YG:
YG owned clubs in Korea charge foreigners an extra $5-10 in cover charge…..why? simply because they are not native Koreans. the irony…..YG is attempting to be a worldwide entertainment company. note to YG: inflation of prices due to one’s passport isn’t usually well received in the Western world….
LucasBunny
Mar 28 2007, 11:08 PM
(jurassic5 @ Mar 28 2007, 09:02 PM) *
YG probably will not make a formal apology unless provoked to…or as some have alluded, if when 7 debuts here in the states and the NAACP catches wind of the incident etc etc….
more irony concerning YG:YG owned clubs in Korea charge foreigners an extra $5-10 in cover charge…..why? simply because they are not native Koreans. the irony…..YG is attempting to be a worldwide entertainment company.
I did not know tha
wow!
Guess u learn something new each day
well hopefully things will change
I don’t wanna turn anyone against YG or make them hate YG because of one person’s mistake.
JuicyFruit21
Mar 28 2007, 11:09 PM
(jurassic5 @ Mar 28 2007, 11:02 PM) *
YG probably will not make a formal apology unless provoked to…or as some have alluded, if when 7 debuts here in the states and the NAACP catches wind of the incident etc etc….
more irony concerning YG:YG owned clubs in Korea charge foreigners an extra $5-10 in cover charge…..why? simply because they are not native Koreans. the irony…..YG is attempting to be a worldwide entertainment company.
wow really? that’s jacked up…man juassic5..the more you talk the less respect i have for YG as a businessman….crazy. as much as i hope these things arent true……. mellow.gif i somehow believe them…one soompier who’s studying in Korea as we speak said they were denied access to a nightclub flat out..because they were foreigners….like there was a sign on the door saying NO FOREIGNERS..which is very reminiscent of the old Jim Crow laws of the south…i wouldn’t be surprised if some of the clubs that allow foreigners had separate bathrooms and seating areas…
jurassic5
Mar 28 2007, 11:15 PM
well, i haven’t lived in Korea since 2005….but during my time there, numerous clubs in Hongdae charged foreigners extra…mainly because they wanted to try and keep the military guys out..or to a minimum.
i just find some of the things that YG does and the way they present themselves at times “interesting”.
granted..they know how to market and sell albums in Korea….but will this translate into the Western world?????
suggestion: make all artists that are crossing-over brush up on that country’s culture (pop culture included) and attitudes (this may have made the original incident not happen?).
LucasBunny
Mar 28 2007, 11:56 PM
Wow Jurassic5 you gotz sum knowledge dude!
I think I’ve been thinking about this way too much
since the day I found out, cuz tonight I had a dream about BigBang lol wacko.gif
clockwatcher
Mar 29 2007, 02:38 AM
juicyfruit21, thanks so much for your very detailed and thoughtful response. I personally don’t like the word but don’t think it’s offensive it in certain contexts but I agree with what you’re saying.
Interesting about foreigners getting charged extra… in some countries, they get in for free. Not that either is better.
rahrah
Mar 29 2007, 04:10 AM
(jurassic5 @ Mar 28 2007, 08:02 PM) *
note to YG: inflation of prices due to one’s passport isn’t usually well received in the Western world….
well, unless u count international student tuition rates. usually 3-4X higher for int’l students at public universities in america.
also, that extra charge was bc girls would go to a different club bc they go to meet korean guys, if the girls leave, then no guys who buy drinks. club owners get less money.
in general, foreigner’s experience in korea is directly correlated with how much korean they learn. the more they learn, the more they enjoy it.
suggestion: make all artists that are crossing-over brush up on that country’s culture (pop culture included) and attitudes (this may have made the original incident not happen?).
i agree 100%
JaiNYc
Mar 29 2007, 10:54 AM
(jurassic5 @ Mar 28 2007, 11:15 PM) *
well, i haven’t lived in Korea since 2005….but during my time there, numerous clubs in Hongdae charged foreigners extra…mainly because they wanted to try and keep the military guys out..or to a minimum.
Why do they try to keep the military guys out?
BoSoxdirtdog
Mar 29 2007, 12:23 PM
(rahrah @ Mar 29 2007, 04:10 AM) *
in general, foreigner’s experience in korea is directly correlated with how much korean they learn. the more they learn, the more they enjoy it.
I didn’t learn a lick of Korean when I was at Yonsei. I had the best time in my life.
rahrah
Mar 29 2007, 12:29 PM
(BoSoxdirtdog @ Mar 29 2007, 09:23 AM) *
I didn’t learn a lick of Korean when I was at Yonsei. I had the best time in my life.
eh. come on now. yonsei IDE and i house is an isolated community for the most part.
thats why i said in general… lol
JuicyFruit21
Mar 29 2007, 01:26 PM
(rahrah @ Mar 29 2007, 04:10 AM) *
well, unless u count international student tuition rates. usually 3-4X higher for int’l students at public universities in america.
that doesn’t count..because they charge extra if you are an out-of-state enrollee as well. tuition rates do not really count in this instance. if you were to go study anywhere other than your native state then you can expect to pay extra. that’s just what it is. you can’t compare tuition rates for something important like education to something trivial and clearly biased as raising the prices for foreigners to enter a club. i’m sure if i were to go study in France my tuition would be slightly higher than that of a native French student.
rahrah
Mar 29 2007, 02:00 PM
(JuicyFruit21 @ Mar 29 2007, 10:26 AM) *
that doesn’t count..because they charge extra if you are an out-of-state enrollee as well. tuition rates do not really count in this instance. if you were to go study anywhere other than your native state then you can expect to pay extra. that’s just what it is. you can’t compare tuition rates for something important like education to something trivial and clearly biased as raising the prices for foreigners to enter a club. i’m sure if i were to go study in France my tuition would be slightly higher than that of a native French student.
im disagreeing with the the way he worded it, this is what he said:
note to YG: inflation of prices due to one’s passport isn’t usually well received in the Western world….
so according to the way this is worded, it is clearly wrong. if u have a foreign passport, u pay higher tuitions. Usually int’l tuition is higher than out of state tuition. People can change their state residency relatively easily.
But the way he worded that statement is clearly wrong. there is inflation due to passports. and it is well received. it is what it is.
as for my personal stance on the issue, i could care less since im not int’l student. so it doesn’t affect me. im more pissed about my taxes going to red states anyways. but im not talking about my personal stance, im talking about the accuracy of that statement.
btw, if US had a Korean military base stationed in the US, and those Korean military soldiers were known for frequenting American bars and raping women, grandmas, assaulting etc… I would be fine with them being charged higher entrance fees to protect women.
http://times.hankooki.com/lpage/nation/200…23431311990.htm
if anyone wants to read that news article about a US military serviceman, raping and beating a 67 year old Korean woman in broad daylight, go ahead.
chairmanK
Mar 29 2007, 02:00 PM
(rahrah @ Mar 29 2007, 01:10 AM) *
well, unless u count international student tuition rates. usually 3-4X higher for int’l students at public universities in america.
But unlike the definition of “international student” (based on one’s passport), the definition of “foreigner” at clubs (and bathhouses, bars, etc.) in Korea can be suspiciously subjective. People who with Korean racial features are usually more welcome than people with non-Korean racial features who live in Korea. Imagine a person affiliated with the U.S. Army who is married to a Korean woman and whose mixed-race children speak Korean at home. (Rare, but these marriages do sometimes happen!) At one of these foreigner-exclusive clubs, this person would be forced to pay extra cover charge because he is a “foreigner”, no matter how well he speaks Korean. Whereas an overseas ethnic Korean, like myself, would be waved through because I look like a native-born Korean. I imagine that even some Japanese or Chinese would be treated as Koreans, not foreigners.
rahrah
Mar 29 2007, 02:15 PM
(chairmanK @ Mar 29 2007, 11:00 AM) *
But unlike the definition of “international student” (based on one’s passport), the definition of “foreigner” at clubs (and bathhouses, bars, etc.) in Korea can be suspiciously subjective. People who with Korean racial features are usually more welcome than people with non-Korean racial features who live in Korea. Imagine a person affiliated with the U.S. Army who is married to a Korean woman and whose mixed-race children speak Korean at home. (Rare, but these marriages do sometimes happen!) At one of these foreigner-exclusive clubs, this person would be forced to pay extra cover charge because he is a “foreigner”, no matter how well he speaks Korean. Whereas an overseas ethnic Korean, like myself, would be waved through because I look like a native-born Korean. I imagine that even some Japanese or Chinese would be treated as Koreans, not foreigners.
im not taking a stance on it. im just disagreeing with the accuracy of that statement that passport status being a determinant of prices is not looked upon favorably in western countries.
btw, although many more instances of Korean grandmothers being raped/killed/beaten etc… by US servicemen, I think in general, rapes have gone down since US military bases have had brothels installed near the US bases. Many of the brothel’s are serviced by SE Asian women, Russian women, and Eastern European women. Their service does help stem the rape of Korean women outside the bases. So in a way, Koreans should be grateful for those US military brothels.
clockwatcher
Mar 29 2007, 02:56 PM
Usually int’l tuition is higher than out of state tuition. People can change their state residency relatively easily.
Well, at my school, International tuition was the same as out-of-state tuition. In other countries like England, international tuition is much higher than native tuition because taxpayer money is being used to pay for the native tuition.
think in general, rapes have gone down since US military bases have had brothels installed near the US bases. Many of the brothel’s are serviced by SE Asian women, Russian women, and Eastern European women. Their service does help stem the rape of Korean women outside the bases. So in a way, Koreans should be grateful for those US military brothels
Wow… so is the logic that men rape because they can’t find prostitutes? lol So how come a lot of idiots rape prostitutes? I honestly can’t believe that you said that women should be happy that there are brothels because they are less likely to be raped!
And where are you getting these statistics from? And how do you know that the number of rapes haven’t gone done for another reason?
rahrah
Mar 29 2007, 03:00 PM
^ I didn’t say women should be happy. I said Koreans should be happy about military brothels around US Army bases. That includes both Korean men and women. I have relatives in Korea. I never said that applies to all brothels or all prostitutes. Just the ones around the US Army bases.
Also, rapes might have gone up. I was just guessing. Now that you mention it, it is possible that rapes around US military bases have been going up. Either way, Im glad military brothels exist in Korea for US Army bases. Im sure they are glad too.
btw, i hope this guy gets the death penalty.
http://times.hankooki.com/lpage/nation/200…23431311990.htm
I hope you can agree this is wrong.
tian`tian
Mar 29 2007, 03:05 PM
Just wanted to make a comment about the guy’s age. I’m not a fan of BigBang, I don’t know them, haven’t listened to any of their music, etc. But just hearing his comment about getting shot reminds me of my cousin.
Honestly, Asians from Asia, like people have said have very little exposure to people of other races, and all they see is from the media or what they hear in music. My cousin who is around that age, seriously thinks that college life and student life in the US is like what he sees in American Pie. When my other cousin, who lived in Asia but came here for college, went back, he asked her that exact question. And she denied it obviously, but he still believes it. He listens to a lot of rap/r&b music, and from the lyrics, he also believes that most black people are “gangsta” like that.
What the guy [Seungri?] said is not right in any way, but I can also understand why he said it. YG should have apologized though. And about your comment of how “these people” were the ones who complained about the Rosie incident, etc. I don’t think they were. They probably didn’t even hear about it.
jurassic5
Mar 29 2007, 06:01 PM
(rahrah @ Mar 29 2007, 02:00 PM) *
But the way he worded that statement is clearly wrong. there is inflation due to passports. and it is well received. it is what it is.
since you’re being technical about my statement….i ask that you read this definition of usually:
normally: under normal conditions
does this mean 100% of the time? no….thus allowing for instances that may happen outside of these conditions such as your example (whether it is similar or not).
as for being overseas korean and getting allowed in to establishments that charge foreigners more…..once they see your alien registration card, you pay the difference.
anyways, back on topic…i guess we all agree that all parties involved in the incident were wrong.
LucasBunny
Mar 30 2007, 01:27 AM
(tian`tian @ Mar 29 2007, 01:05 PM) *
What the guy [Seungri?] said is not right in any way, but I can also understand why he said it. YG should have apologized though. And about your comment of how “these people” were the ones who complained about the Rosie incident, etc. I don’t think they were. They probably didn’t even hear about it.
Actually some of them were
and they did hear about it cuz I saw it.
LucasBunny
Mar 30 2007, 01:43 AM
(clockwatcher @ Mar 29 2007, 12:56 PM) *
Wow… so is the logic that men rape because they can’t find prostitutes? lol So how come a lot of idiots rape prostitutes? I honestly can’t believe that you said that women should be happy that there are brothels because they are less likely to be raped!And where are you getting these statistics from? And how do you know that the number of rapes haven’t gone done for another reason?
I agree 100%
Where did the subject rape come from anyway???
Women should not happy that they are brothels
and it doesnt give them a less chance of getting raped!
rahrah
Mar 30 2007, 12:49 PM
(LucasBunny @ Mar 29 2007, 10:43 PM) *
I agree 100%Where did the subject rape come from anyway???
Women should not happy that they are brothels
and it doesnt give them a less chance of getting raped!
http://www.aprnet.org/index.php?a=show&…rences&i=93
Here is an article about military brothels just for US Army.
A congressional report in Korea estimated that between 1967 and 1987, more than 30,000 crimes were committed by U.S. military personnel against Korean civilians. This included murder, brutal rapes and sexual abuse.
Why don’t you protest it. I am sure they will listen to you.
cindel25
Mar 30 2007, 02:39 PM
I think we all agree the comment was wrong and ignorant. The people who I thought were my friends here at soompi did not have my back when I was protesting the issue. One person flat out said “I don’t give F…” about the issue. I was really hurt and disappointed.
As you can see from my siggie, I blogged about this incident and I got into a shouting match with a Korean YG Fan at the site. To the point, YG knows about the situation and has yet not made a statement. Tiff and Ash don’t know about this but I am taking it a step further and will be mailing my blog(mirror cds and letters) to YG office next month.
As far as Masta Wu goes, I am a fan but I refuse to buy his album because of the song that has a N word. But like Tiff said, it wasn’t banned for what we were protesting about. How sad indeed.
To the person who mention Ice Cube “Black Korea”; Tiger Jk from Drunken Tiger was the one who called him out and they had a Hip Hop Summit about the issue. That is when he apologized.
rahrah
Mar 30 2007, 02:45 PM
(cindel25 @ Mar 30 2007, 11:39 AM) *
To the person who mention Ice Cube “Black Korea”; Tiger Jk from Drunken Tiger was the one who called him out and they had a Hip Hop Summit about the issue. That is when he apologized.
haha drunken tiger was around in 92? nah i don’t think so.
The Korean American Grocer’s Association (KAGRO) joined in and hit Cube where it hurt – his endorsement deal with St. Ides. KAGRO demanded that they drop Cube and when they didn’t, they stopped St. Ides from being sold in over 5,000 stores across the country. Ice Cube stepped in and tried to make amends w/ an apology in February of 1992, and both the ban and the boycott were lifted.
it was money that made him apologize. it wasn’t sincere. but who really gives a —- now? not the thread starter, thats for sure.
if u want revenge on them, take it. do it. but don’t expect something no one else was willing to do.
(edit: easy on the swears….next time you’ll get warned-J5)
cindel25
Mar 30 2007, 02:58 PM
(rahrah @ Mar 30 2007, 02:45 PM) *
haha drunken tiger was around in 92? nah i don’t think so.
it was money that made him apologize. it wasn’t sincere. but who really gives a phuck now? not the thread starter, thats for sure.if u want revenge on them, take it. do it. but don’t expect something no one else was willing to do.
Tiger JK confirmed this issue himself and you check out the articles.
ETA:
In 1992, rapper Ice Cube released a song called “Black Korea,” a song made in response to a shooting of a 15 year old black girl by a Korean shop owner. The song specifically degraded Koreans to what Ice Cube called “Oriental one-penny-countin’ motherjohn teshers,” but not many from the Korean community responded to the song. After hearing the song, Tiger JK made it his responsibility to show that these stereotypes were untrue and had to be broken. At a hip-hop show that promoted racial harmony, JK spoke his feelings in lyrics rather than a speech…
Revenge? Who is talking revenge? If you do not care, please stay out of the situation. You’ve made your opinion known.
rahrah
Mar 30 2007, 03:05 PM
^ what year was that hip hop summit? after 92. where was the apology? i don’t see it. latasha harlins knocked out a korean lady hitting her 4 times in the face, so the korean lady shot the girl in the back of the head while latasha was walking away. she should have gotten jail time cus of her temper, but she didn’t.
u just said ice cube apologized at the hip hop summit. i don’t see it. facts are more important than opionions to me. he never apologized outside of the time he did in 92 and that was cus of money.
i could care less but if ur gonna say something has to be done this way and be sincere, then i don’t see why it should when historically that wasn’t the case. why can’t an apology be fake and bc of money? if ur gonna make stuff up about ice cube apologizing at a hip hop summit, then fine. at least admit it.
is a fake apology supposed to be better than no apology? whats ur opinion? i think a fake apology is better than no apology. but in no way, does someone have to make a sincere apology in this case. look at the history.
wateva
Mar 30 2007, 05:05 PM
hhmmm i never heard of these incidences till you pointed them out lucas_bunny, cause im not a big bang fan
indeed we do live in a narrow minded world
but what i dont get is that why would a company like YG who clearly mold and promote their artists take influences (to say the least) from african american artists, but theres no respect from where it came from, and to be so dismissive of your complaint their basically brushing their international fans off as bieng irrelevant to them, when incidently se7en is preparing to debut in the US. im sure this ‘verbal slip’ will comeback to bite them in the ass and its gonna affect poorly on se7en’s image….
and the master wu thing…..he shows such ignorance…..the N word has such dark history behind it, it can be derogatory for people who dont understand it but an empowering word for african americans and he obviously has no idea where the origin of that word came from.
but i remember on the david chapelle show ( that man is funny) where he had a guest, and the man was talking about how, ‘everybody wanted to talk black, act black, walk black, becuase its cool, but no one wants to actually Be black’ and i think thats true in this scenario and countless others
and the rosie thing while im ranting SHE IS SOOO NOT FUNNY
LucasBunny
Mar 30 2007, 09:11 PM
(cindel25 @ Mar 30 2007, 12:39 PM) *
I think we all agree the comment was wrong and ignorant. The people who I thought were my friends here at soompi did not have my back when I was protesting the issue. One person flat out said “I don’t give F…” about the issue. I was really hurt and disappointed.As you can see from my siggie, I blogged about this incident and I got into a shouting match with a Korean YG Fan at the site. To the point, YG knows about the situation and has yet not made a statement. Tiff and Ash don’t know about this but I am taking it a step further and will be mailing my blog(mirror cds and letters) to YG office next month.
As far as Masta Wu goes, I am a fan but I refuse to buy his album because of the song that has a N word. But like Tiff said, it wasn’t banned for what we were protesting about. How sad indeed.
To the person who mention Ice Cube “Black Korea”; Tiger Jk from Drunken Tiger was the one who called him out and they had a Hip Hop Summit about the issue. That is when he apologized.
Ahhh Sophia
I couldnt agree more
and I didnt know you were mailing stuffs, why didnt u say so???
Like Sophia I still like Wu, but I dun wanna buy his album
atleast right now because this is getting ignored!
I don’t think he meant harm but he know that term is wrong!
(rahrah @ Mar 30 2007, 12:45 PM) *
haha drunken tiger was around in 92? nah i don’t think so.
it was money that made him apologize. it wasn’t sincere. but who really gives a —- now? not the thread starter, thats for sure.if u want revenge on them, take it. do it. but don’t expect something no one else was willing to do.
(edit: easy on the swears….next time you’ll get warned-J5)
What in the world????
what are you talking about???
who wants to get revenge??
I made it clear in the beginning that no one was out to get YG!
I am still a YG fan!! Just a dissappointed one!
and how do you know what made Ice Cube apologize??? and how do you know what I think???
rahrah
Mar 31 2007, 02:14 PM
(LucasBunny @ Mar 30 2007, 06:11 PM) *
and how do you know what made Ice Cube apologize??? and how do you know what I think???
Its not my words, but various people who did research about it.
http://www.aspeninstitute.org/atf/cf/%7BDE…%7D/5Morgan.pdf
While Ice Cube, African American community representatives and Korean
merchants lobbed charges of censorship and bigotry, only a few Asian
Americans in the hip hop audience protested or participated in the resolution
Within months of the song’s release, Ice
Cube issued an apology to avert a boycott of products he promoted by Korean
storeowners who control convenience stores in South Central Los Angeles.
look at other links if you don’t believe me. but don’t deny what it is
http://www.google.com/search?hl=ko&new…C%83%89&lr=
a lot of things have happened since then.
Ladyhawke
Apr 1 2007, 11:42 PM
I don’t listen to Big Bang, but I can say that the comment was inappropriate. YG needs to step up to the plate and take it on the chin. Their response is unacceptable. Non-Koreans fans deserve respect. We are supportive. Plus respect goes beyond what racial group you are in. Respect is a human right.
The artist should recognize his mistake and seek to understand it. If he will not, YG should take the role of the mentor and embrace the artist and inform him, encourage him to learn from this matter.
Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it. No destructive lies. No ridiculous fears. No debilitating anger.
Bill Bradley
…
I am not getting into the specifics of the Ice Cube incident but based on my studies in and out of the classroom, a lot of the tension that exists between African Americans and Koreans in LA is simply a matter of existing racial issues, economics, and cultural difference. A lot of businesses left LA and left African Americans hanging, disinfranchised, and torn as a community. Koreans immigrated and sticked together to etch out a life in a foreign land. Some Koreans went back to Korea but others stayed. The ones that stayed worked together to build businesses. Unfortunately, these business replaced many of the businesses African Americans worked in and patronaged. Some of the resentment that built up in the African American community was misdirected, what some saw were another group of people making money off them now and they had very little. Immigrants to some seemed to get more from the government than they did. There were some riffs over housing.
The city and state really didn’t do enough to assuage any of the misunderstandings. It should be understood that Koreans opened their stores in poor areas. There is sadly a lot of crime in non-prosperous areas. Koreans became scared and tensions worsened. That incident of the young black girl on top of the Rodney King event escalated tensions and African Americans and Koreans got swept into it.
It’s really a sad thing, and I don’t live there and I didn’t live there during that time. My thoughts are based on a collection of writings from all matters of perspective including Korean immigrants and Korean Americans who have written about the events.
Misunderstandings fuel so much of our problems.
…
Jumping back to the Big Bang member’s comments… it doesn’t serve to improve relationships between races nor human beings to say what he said.
I am going to write to YG and I am going to Boycott their label until I hear, see, etc an apology. The best way I can show my support for humanity is with my voice and economics.
beloved-shadowqueen
Apr 1 2007, 11:59 PM
I can’t believe he would say such a thing.
jurassic5
Apr 2 2007, 12:06 AM
(beloved-shadowqueen @ Apr 1 2007, 11:59 PM) *
I can’t believe he would say such a thing.
I can’t believe you posted here.
Born Aug-17-1989
please come back and post in 3+ years. Thank You.
the.elephant
Apr 2 2007, 05:56 PM
i didnt have time to read thru all the posts but i will later…
i just wanted to say this… 90% of all crime commited in US is by young male african american. this doesnt mean 90% of african american are criminals.
clockwatcher
Apr 2 2007, 11:16 PM
(the.elephant @ Apr 2 2007, 05:56 PM) *
i just wanted to say this… 90% of all crime commited in US is by young male african american.
Please stop writing such untrue statements.
Ladyhawke
Apr 2 2007, 11:21 PM
(the.elephant @ Apr 2 2007, 03:56 PM) *
i didnt have time to read thru all the posts but i will later…i just wanted to say this… 90% of all crime commited in US is by young male african american. this doesnt mean 90% of african american are criminals.
I totally agree with clockwatcher. That’s uncalled for and not accurate at all.
jurassic5
Apr 2 2007, 11:30 PM
(the.elephant @ Apr 2 2007, 05:56 PM) *
i just wanted to say this… 90% of all crime commited in US is by young male african american.
i just wanted to say this….before you post ignorant and comments, please educate yourself.
In 2005, 69.8 percent of all persons arrested in the United States were white and 27.8 percent were black. The remainder of persons arrested were American Indian or Alaskan Native (1.3 percent) and Asian or Pacific Islander (1.0 percent).
FBI
(consider this a warning for posting ignorant content)
LucasBunny
Apr 2 2007, 11:38 PM
(the.elephant @ Apr 2 2007, 03:56 PM) *
i didnt have time to read thru all the posts but i will later…i just wanted to say this… 90% of all crime commited in US is by young male african american. this doesnt mean 90% of african american are criminals.
Oh brother where did u get that information?
cindel25
Apr 3 2007, 11:58 AM
(the.elephant @ Apr 2 2007, 05:56 PM) *
i didnt have time to read thru all the posts but i will later…i just wanted to say this… 90% of all crime commited in US is by young male african american. this doesnt mean 90% of african american are criminals.
i just wanted to say this…YOU ARE IGNORANT. What source did you get this from?
mujisan
Apr 3 2007, 12:31 PM
I know the discussion has somewhat evolved in the last few days, but I’m just going to comment on the original post at this time.
I think the comment by Seungri is indeed offensive and you and your friends are right to feel offended by it. Heck, I feel offended for you! And it is absolutely right to let the powers that be know that you are offended fans. The celebrities are nothing without the support of fans and this incident plus no response from YG or Seungri really gives out a bad message to the fans. It makes it seem like they don’t care what the fans think.
I think Seungri’s comment is ignorant, not necessarily coming from a racist place. I agree that people from Asian countries have limited exposure to people of African descent, but that is not an excuse nor is Seungri’s age of 16. Seungri is old enough to earn a living, therefore he should be able to be responsible for his own actions.
Masta Wu’s ‘N’ word: big no no. Although this has been explained to me by my African American friends, I still don’t quite understand the logic. But I do know this is a cultural thing among certain parts of the African American community where it is OK to address each other with the ‘N’ word, but not OK if said by other races. An example of how cultural research can avoid misunderstandings and ultimately major public faux pas.
Seungri should apologize, especially if he and Big Bang wish to try out the US market.
LucasBunny
Apr 3 2007, 11:39 PM
(mujisan @ Apr 3 2007, 10:31 AM) *
Masta Wu’s ‘N’ word: big no no. Although this has been explained to me by my African American friends, I still don’t quite understand the logic. But I do know this is a cultural thing among certain parts of the African American community where it is OK to address each other with the ‘N’ word, but not OK if said by other races. An example of how cultural research can avoid misunderstandings and ultimately major public faux pas.Seungri should apologize, especially if he and Big Bang wish to try out the US market.
I feel you
Like I was watching an episode of girlfriends
and they were singing Jay-Z’s “H.O.V.A”
and Lynn’s white sister was singing along with them
and they were all singing fine until Jay-z says the “N” word and Lynn’s sister
says it, but only as the song
everyone got upset at her for singing the song.
I will never understand why some black people find it okay to use that term
but get upset at other races saying it.
But all black people are not like that.
Like I said I’m not offended by that term, if someone called me that
I would probably laugh at there foolishness because I know I’m not an “N” word.
But I know other people are offended by it and I know why and I don’t blame them.
monchichi
Apr 4 2007, 01:55 AM
Replying to the first post, I thought the artist’s comment was very narrow minded and the company should have had him apoligise publicly.
Even though he’s young, I hardly think a comment like that should just be brushed off and ignored. If they continue like this, wouldn’t it develop prejudice toward the african-american population amongst Korean residents considering he has celebrity status and holds sway over a lot of his fans?
Everybody makes stupid comments all the time, but they always apologise for it afterwards. He should be no different.
Boo to YG.
And as for the.elephant’s comment, I think you have a few screws loose in your head. Please research before you post something so absurd.
dianannsano
Apr 4 2007, 01:09 PM
(the.elephant @ Apr 2 2007, 02:56 PM) *
i didnt have time to read thru all the posts but i will later…i just wanted to say this… 90% of all crime commited in US is by young male african american. this doesnt mean 90% of african american are criminals.
Dude, what source did you read to get that information? It might be true that a majority of those convicted and end up in jail are ethnic minorities, but that’s due to some discrimination in the judicial system.
But I am positive that 90% of all crimes committed in the US are NOT by young male African Americans.
In addition, what about white-collar crime?
cindel25
Apr 6 2007, 10:51 AM
I find it funny how people are quick to bring up the Ice Cube “Black Korea” issue like that makes it ok.
1. Ice Cube was wrong just as Seungri was wrong.
2. Ice Cube has apologize; Seungri and YG have not.
The issue here is personal responsibility. You can say whatever the hell you want but TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR WORDS AND ACTIONS.
rahrah
Apr 6 2007, 01:16 PM
(cindel25 @ Apr 6 2007, 07:51 AM) *
I find it funny how people are quick to bring up the Ice Cube “Black Korea” issue like that makes it ok.1. Ice Cube was wrong just as Seungri was wrong.
2. Ice Cube has apologize; Seungri and YG have not.
The issue here is personal responsibility. You can say whatever the hell you want but TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR WORDS AND ACTIONS.
when u said people, i think u meant me. i bet u want to shut me up huh? LOL how ironic and funny is that.
ice cube’s song eventually helped flame the LA Riots in 1992. 5,000 Korean businesses were burned down, over $1 Billion in damages total. People are still suffering from the LA Riots today. do some research on it.
Most people in Korea, their impression of Black people is from what they saw in the news of the 1992 LA Riots. have u ever heard of 4-29?
All I said is that if they apologize, it doesn’t have to be sincere. Ice Cube only apologized because Korean grocers threatened to drop St. Ides’ from their stores. St. Ides had a contract with Ice Cube. He would not have apologized otherwise. In other words, it was for money.
No one complained it was insincere tho. But yup. thats what it is.
ice cube’s was way worse. much much worse. people died bc of what he said.
cindel25
Apr 6 2007, 01:31 PM
^This is THE FOURTH time “Black Korea” has been brought up in this situation. So please get over yourself.
The song did not flame the L.A. Riots; please educate yourself before making unfounded statements.
The Rodney King verdict was a trigger but also unemployment, racial profiling, abusive treatment by the L.A.P.D and L.A. corrupt political establishment were factors.
ice cube’s was way worse. much much worse. people died bc of what he said.
Are you for real?
rahrah
Apr 6 2007, 01:53 PM
(cindel25 @ Apr 6 2007, 10:31 AM) *
^This is THE FOURTH time “Black Korea” has been brought up in this situation. So please get over yourself.The song did not flame the L.A. Riots; please educate yourself before making unfounded statements.
The Rodney King verdict was a trigger but also unemployment, racial profiling, abusive treatment by the L.A.P.D and L.A. corrupt political establishment were factors.
Are you for real?
wow. at the time, in LA, there was a lot of tension before the riots. u just have to be there to know. that song did help flame.
i said it helped flame. also u have the latasha harlins incident, and the judge who let off the korean lady with a slap on the wrist. also, mainstream media’s willingness and constant fear to deflect blame from whites to koreans.
also, there’s only so much u can learn from the internet little one. =) but i would def. say that song did spark huge tensions and did contribute significantly to what would happen later.
mofo
Apr 6 2007, 04:45 PM
he’s a stupid lil kid. don’t put too much faith in pop stars.
precious4e
Apr 6 2007, 06:02 PM
^ hahahaha true true
as to the original post all I have to say is: His comment was definitely offensive and ignorant. I hate how people get all upset when they are discriminated against but don’t give a damn when they do it or it happens to someone else. I’m glad that you brought up the issue with YG. Hopefully they’ll own up to it. If they ever want to make it big outside of Korea they’re going to have to learn to be more tactful with these issues.
LucasBunny
Apr 6 2007, 10:23 PM
(rahrah @ Apr 6 2007, 11:16 AM) *
ice cube’s song eventually helped flame the LA Riots in 1992. 5,000 Korean businesses were burned down, over $1 Billion in damages total. People are still suffering from the LA Riots today. do some research on it.Most people in Korea, their impression of Black people is from what they saw in the news of the 1992 LA Riots. have u ever heard of 4-29?
ice cube’s was way worse. much much worse. people died bc of what he said.
What??
that’s not even true
first of all, people did not die because of that song
the big reasons behind the LA riots was because of the reasons stated by my gurl Sophia.
People didnt die because of that song
and stop comparing this to the black korea song
because the situations are different.
(cindel25 @ Apr 6 2007, 11:31 AM) *
^This is FOURTH time “Black Korea” has been brought up in this situation. So please get over yourself. rolleyes.gifThe song did not flame the L.A. Riots; please educate yourself before making unfounded statements.
The Rodney King verdict was a trigger but also unemployment, racial profiling, abusive treatment by the L.A.P.D and L.A. corrupt political establishment were factors.
Are you for real?
Agreed
clockwatcher
Apr 7 2007, 09:38 PM
Wasn’t Ice Cube’s song a reaction to the Latasha Harlins case? Black Korea was a reaction to that song so if you want to blame the LA riots on Black Korea, it seems like the Latasha Harlins case is the real culprit not Ice Cube. And what did Ice Cube help flame? Didn’t a Korean grocer murder a 15 year old African American girl in cold blood? If he’d never recorded that song wouldn’t people still have been very angry about how that case and how it was handled? Please let’s be reasonable.
Ice Cube didn’t cause any damn riots. The issues he rapped about played a part but the song itself didn’t. It’s not like the people were walking around happy with their lives and situation till they heard the song.
But seriously, Ice Cube and whatever does not in any way absolve these people of what they said. These cases are not even related. And if you want to blame Black Korea on these Korean artists’ perception of African Americans, shouldn’t they be more scared of Korean grocers?
rahrah
Apr 8 2007, 02:57 AM
a korean lady shot latasha harlins in the back, right after latasha hit the korean lady four times in the face, and knocked her out.
the korean lady was pissed, so she shot latasha out of anger while latasha was walking away. Im sorry, if someone punched me four times in the face first, and i had a gun in my hand, i would be pretty pissed off and would probably do the same. but i would expect jail time for it. would it be worth it? not in the long run, but dont say it was a cold blooded murder. uh… it was a woman who wanted to get the last word after getting knocked out being punched 4 times in the face. u guys are like all lying. calling it a cold blooded murder, saying ice cube apologized at a hip hop summit. WTF? U guys are worse than anyone defending big bang or whoever.
anyways, it was wrong, the lady did deserve some jail time. but the judge who was a white lady, gave her probation only. so blacks were pretty pissed. this verdict came during very high tensions during the Rodney King trial, which was pretty huge during the time.
riots started right after the rodney king verdict. but since white communities were inaccessible to south central LA bc of distance and police, they took their anger out on korean businesses instead who were closer by.
here are the lyrics to “Black Korea” which was pretty publicized among black and korean communities at the time. read it.
Everytime I wanna go get a john teshin brew
I gotta go down to the store with the two
oriental one-penny countin motherjohn teshers
that make a hello kitty made enough to cause a little ruckus
Thinkin every brother in the world’s out to take
So they watch every damn move that I make
They hope I don’t pull out a gat and try to rob
they funky little store, but pinkberry, I got a job
(“Look you little Chinese motherjohn tesher
I ain’t tryin to steal none of yo’ mini cooper, leave me alone!”
“Mother-john tesh you!”)
Yo yo, check it out
So don’t follow me, up and down your market
Or your little chop suey ass’ll be a target
of the nationwide boycott
Juice with the people, that’s what the boy got
So pay respect to the black fist
or we’ll burn your store, right down to a crisp
And then we’ll see ya!
Cause you can’t turn the ghetto – into Black Korea
i said several times, his song helped flame the LA Riots. if u like making stuff up so much, then ur just that immature. i said it helped, i never said it was the only cause.
out of all the impressions that blacks in america has left on koreans in korea, the biggest was probably the LA Riots, which was covered pretty extensively on tv at the time.
it is what it is. btw, some of u guys are pretty immature when it comes to reality. deal with it thats what happened. that song was very racist and definitely helped spark the LA Riots. and ice cube never apologized sincerely.
i heard it all before. if u want to deny what happened, make up lies and exaggerate about thousands of koreans who had their entire lives, families, businesses ruined, just for being korean, there is nothing wrong with anyone denying what happened to you. btw, i can name three friends whose parents were killed by blacks in robberies in their stores in south LA. they don’t hate blacks at all tho, even tho they lost a parent for the rest of their lives. but like i said, your reactions to what happened in the past, is just as immature as any responses to this thread in the under 20 sections. so don’t act like ur better than anyone else.
im done. latez.
*edit*
anyways… what happened was wrong, of course thats understandable, i said that in the beginning of this thread… i hope u guys find some peace with it some way thru something… but after seeing what u kind of wrote in reaction to things i brought up, it just ruined it for me.
anyways, ur just gonna have to say ice cube’s song was racist and wrong, before I can say I support ur thing now too. i REALLY don’t care if he apologizes sincerely or not cus i rather just forget about it, but now i just want to hear u guys say u his song was racist and wrong. i kind of wonder why its so hard for you to do since the incidents are seperate, but the reactions of people are the same.
LucasBunny
Apr 8 2007, 06:44 AM
(rahrah @ Apr 8 2007, 12:57 AM) *
a korean lady shot latasha harlins in the back, right after latasha hit the korean lady four times in the face, and knocked her out.
Lol if she knocked her out how did she shoot her??
Obviosly u didnt see the video, it’s all on tape!
cuz if u did, u would see that she hit latasha harlins first, then she hit her back
the moment lakisha walked into that store she was treating her like a criminal.
So instead of calling the police she took the girls life.
Please there is no justification for the korean grocers behavior because she was wrong from the get go.
She did not have to take that girls life, it was cold blooded murder.
Stop blaming the tension between the blacks and koreans on black people only.
Please stop talking about the LA riots because your information is wrong
that was in 1992, this is 2007.
Nobody’s trying to act like they are better,
nobody is saying Ice Cube song was extremly offensive
but you are missing the point of the thread!
You are turning this into an LA riots thread.
This is about the sitaution with Suengri
not about Ice cube’s black korea song.
The situations are not the same because you have lil ol Suengri
a 15yr old who is doing hip hop and r&b something made famouse by black people!
It’s very ironic he would say such thing.
Please no one take offense to this
but people talk about the reasons koreand dislike black people so much
well how come some koreans can dislike black people so much but incorprate so much of our culture into the things they do.
That would be like me, enjoying things done by koreans then go and say
“I can’t go into a korean grocery store, they might shoot me for buying a juice”
Hip Hop and r&b is popular in korea
and OMG Bboying, very very very big amongst koreans today
things made big by african americans, so people should realize the things that black people have done for this world,
and if it werent for them they wouldnt have some of the things that they do.
If it werent for black people bboying wouldnt mean anything in korea.
neither would hip hip and r&b, there would be no 1tym, Se7en, Big Bang, Big Mama, Drunken Tiger etc.
This is why I found the whole thing ironic.
LucasBunny
Apr 8 2007, 10:17 AM
(rahrah @ Apr 8 2007, 12:57 AM) *
riots started right after the rodney king verdict. but since white communities were inaccessible to south central LA bc of distance and police, they took their anger out on korean businesses instead who were closer by.
Oh my goodness
no that’s not what happened!
KYC
Apr 8 2007, 11:35 AM
ppl are racist…doesnt matter how “pc” we get….there’s still racism. Yada yada….off course stars should know better and learn to keep thier mouth shut sometimes…oh well.
Ladyhawke
Apr 8 2007, 01:20 PM
I totally agree with you L..B. It is all ironic.
I agree with others that this 2007 not 1992.
I think its time to move and concentrate on the here and now.
tian`tian
Apr 8 2007, 03:02 PM
(LucasBunny @ Apr 8 2007, 05:44 AM) *
Please no one take offense to this
but people talk about the reasons koreand dislike black people so much
well how come some koreans can dislike black people so much but incorprate so much of our culture into the things they do.That would be like me, enjoying things done by koreans then go and say
“I can’t go into a korean grocery store, they might shoot me for buying a juice”Hip Hop and r&b is popular in korea
and OMG Bboying, very very very big amongst koreans today
things made big by african americans, so people should realize the things that black people have done for this world,
and if it werent for them they wouldnt have some of the things that they do.If it werent for black people bboying wouldnt mean anything in korea.
neither would hip hip and r&b, there would be no 1tym, Se7en, Big Bang, Big Mama, Drunken Tiger etc.This is why I found the whole thing ironic.
There are a lot of things that Asians have done in general for the world, made popular, but for the most part people still think it’s okay to make racist comments and such about them.
I’m not saying it’s okay, I’m just saying that’s how things work.
LucasBunny
Apr 8 2007, 03:45 PM
(tian`tian @ Apr 8 2007, 01:02 PM) *
There are a lot of things that Asians have done in general for the world, made popular, but for the most part people still think it’s okay to make racist comments and such about them.I’m not saying it’s okay, I’m just saying that’s how things work.
U completly missed the point I was trying to make!
Its’ ironice for a person who bases there profession on X race to make such a foolish comment about that race.
tian`tian
Apr 8 2007, 03:54 PM
(LucasBunny @ Apr 8 2007, 02:45 PM) *
U completly missed the point I was trying to make!Its’ ironice for a person who bases there profession on X race to make such a foolish comment about that race.
Hmm well then from that point of view, you have to say that blacks made the gang culture popular THROUGH R&B/Rap as well, which then perpetuated the stereotype through what people hear, and caused those kind of comments.
It IS foolish to make that comment, it IS wrong, he SHOULD apologize, but you also need to see WHY he made that comment in the first place.
JuicyFruit21
Apr 8 2007, 04:47 PM
(tian`tian @ Apr 8 2007, 03:54 PM) *
Hmm well then from that point of view, you have to say that blacks made the gang culture popular THROUGH R&B/Rap as well, which then perpetuated the stereotype through what people hear, and caused those kind of comments.
um..i’ve never heard an R&B song that glorified gang life….rap yes..r&b..not so much…
also everybody tries to say music is to blame for X person’s actions..what ever happened to being responsible for yourself. it’s like the blame game. it happend with Marilyn Manson, Ozzy Osbourne… and even in this thread with Ice Cube..like wtf. take responsibility for your self and your actions…regardless if the consequences are good or bad. (i’m not just directing this at Seungri either..this is for everybody, myself included)
i feel what ash is tryna say. for him to emulate and ‘’study” black culture from his style of dress, all the way down to the slang he speaks, you’d think that he’d have enough common sense to know that black people arent the only people out there who would shoot someone. as for the stereotypes enforcing his way of thinking…if he really feels that way, and still acts and dresses the way he does..then he’s a poser and a fake. sorta a malibu’s most wanted thing, don’t you think? or maybe a vanilla ice? whatever.
i mean it’s ok for him to dress how he wants and act how he wants, but i think it’s a bit grimy and ironic for him to think that way about the people he’s biting his style from.
and i still think he should apologize(or his company) but like i said before……
rahrah
Apr 9 2007, 04:44 AM
(LucasBunny @ Apr 8 2007, 03:44 AM) *
Lol if she knocked her out how did she shoot her??Obviosly u didnt see the video, it’s all on tape!
cuz if u did, u would see that she hit latasha harlins first, then she hit her back
the moment lakisha walked into that store she was treating her like a criminal.So instead of calling the police she took the girls life.
Please there is no justification for the korean grocers behavior because she was wrong from the get go.
She did not have to take that girls life, it was cold blooded murder.
Stop blaming the tension between the blacks and koreans on black people only.Please stop talking about the LA riots because your information is wrong
that was in 1992, this is 2007.Nobody’s trying to act like they are better,
nobody is saying Ice Cube song was extremly offensive
but you are missing the point of the thread!
You are turning this into an LA riots thread.This is about the sitaution with Suengri
not about Ice cube’s black korea song.The situations are not the same because you have lil ol Suengri
a 15yr old who is doing hip hop and r&b something made famouse by black people!
It’s very ironic he would say such thing.Please no one take offense to this
but people talk about the reasons koreand dislike black people so much
well how come some koreans can dislike black people so much but incorprate so much of our culture into the things they do.That would be like me, enjoying things done by koreans then go and say
“I can’t go into a korean grocery store, they might shoot me for buying a juice”Hip Hop and r&b is popular in korea
and OMG Bboying, very very very big amongst koreans today
things made big by african americans, so people should realize the things that black people have done for this world,
and if it werent for them they wouldnt have some of the things that they do.If it werent for black people bboying wouldnt mean anything in korea.
neither would hip hip and r&b, there would be no 1tym, Se7en, Big Bang, Big Mama, Drunken Tiger etc.This is why I found the whole thing ironic.
the korean lady didn’t hit latasha first. she grabbed latasha’s arm, because latasha put a drink in her backpack with money in her hand hidden and was testing the korean lady to see how she would react.
the korean lady didn’t normally work as a clerk, she was only filling in for her son that day bc his son was threatened to be killed because he was going to testify against a gang that robbed them earlier. so she filled in for him, without much experience, but as a woman with a temper. im sure u know women with irrational tempers.
she got knocked out on her back. and she was pissed off and just let her temper flare. it happens. people lose their tempers. it was wrong and she should have served jail time tho. i know blacks get treated pretty bad by the judicial system, but from a korean’s perspective, how does that have a connection to black white history of fair justice for each other? none at all. there is no ownership of legacy and history. no one asked koreans to be an impartial judge to black white history and take part in the emotional damage from that.
anyways, u can’t even admit ice cube’s song was messed up and racist. i mean, wow… did koreans enslave blacks or something? what makes it so difficult to admit it was racist and wrong? the only reason this thread is turning into a discussion about the LA Riots and Black Korea is because your reaction is the same as many under 20 kids here. denial and refusal to admit something was messed up and racist. you can’t own up to anything in your mind, so i don’t see why u would expect the same in return.
most koreans moved out of black neighborhoods after the LA Riots anyways. make up whatever u want, its just funny now to see how hard it is for you to just flat out say his song was racist and messed up because his perceptions of what was going on was justified and true for all koreans. lol
JuicyFruit21
Apr 9 2007, 02:28 PM
@ rahrah…
nobody said ice cubes song wasn’t racist.everybody here in this thread has pretty much admitted that ice cube’s song wasn’t the best way to go about things….if you haven’t noticed you are the only one still hanging on and bringing it up trying to justify the woman and other korean’s behaviors after the incident. the song was racist. the riots were wrong and pretty much everything about the whole situation back then was wrong. ice cube apologized. YG has not. this thread was about YG. not about the riots.
korean people long before that had an attitude of fear when they associated with black people. so don’t try to make it like because of ice cubes song all the chaos erupted. there was tension between the black community and the korean community long before that and you know it. so just stop reaching.
LucasBunny
Apr 9 2007, 02:35 PM
(rahrah @ Apr 9 2007, 02:44 AM) *
anyways, u can’t even admit ice cube’s song was messed up and racist. i mean, wow… did koreans enslave blacks or something? what makes it so difficult to admit it was racist and wrong? the only reason this thread is turning into a discussion about the LA Riots and Black Korea is because your reaction is the same as many under 20 kids here. denial and refusal to admit something was messed up and racist. you can’t own up to anything in your mind, so i don’t see why u would expect the same in return.most koreans moved out of black neighborhoods after the LA Riots anyways. make up whatever u want, its just funny now to see how hard it is for you to just flat out say his song was racist and messed up because his perceptions of what was going on was justified and true for all koreans. lol
Omg no said the song wasnt racist!
If u read through no one is justifying the song
but what ur not understanding is this is not about the LA riots or Ice Cube
it’s about what happened with Suengri.
Stop being a selective reader rahrah!
clockwatcher
Apr 9 2007, 03:33 PM
rahrah,
This is how it goes. It appears that you’ve been bringing up all sorts of things to try to justify racism. In this thread, you’ve mentioned college admission policies, rape/prostitution (in the Xenophobia discussion), Black Korea and the LA riots at different points when the issue is some artist making an ignorant comment about getting shot by a black person. That’s why this discussion is turning into an LA riots discussion because you keep bringing it up as some sort of justification for Korean prejudice against African Americans and not because no one wants to admit that Black Korea is wrong.
A lot of people who’ve never met a black person, who know nothing about the LA riots are racist towards black people. A lot of people who have nothing to do with slavery etc are racist towards black people and vice versa. So I don’t even understand why you’re bringing up slavery/black-white issues and what not. So what is your explanation for Koreans who are racist towards Indians and vice versa? Again, you’re bringing another irrelevant issue into this.
If someone goes into a store and gets followed and watched the entire time, if they feel any tension towards the storekeeper, trust me, it’s not about any damn slavery. Apparently, this happened in many stores prior to the LA riots so if there was any tension between blacks and Koreans it might have something to do with that. And probably for other reasons as well. And it’s not about having any prior history but how the two communities treat and regard one another in current time. I am not saying that there weren’t any Korean stores that got robbed by black people or anything, either. And I’m not saying that people didn’t bring along any prior prejudice they already had against black people when they initially immigrated.
I mean, you’re still trying to justify that lady killing that girl by talking about women’s irrational temper (now you’re getting sexist) and what not.
The Black Korea song was racist. No doubt about it. It was provoked by what he felt was a racist incident, but in and of itself, it was racist. But what does that have do to with what Seung Ri or whomever said? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
rahrah
Apr 9 2007, 06:32 PM
(JuicyFruit21 @ Apr 9 2007, 11:28 AM) *
@ rahrah…nobody said ice cubes song wasn’t racist.everybody here in this thread has pretty much admitted that ice cube’s song wasn’t the best way to go about things….if you haven’t noticed you are the only one still hanging on and bringing it up trying to justify the woman and other korean’s behaviors after the incident. the song was racist. the riots were wrong and pretty much everything about the whole situation back then was wrong. ice cube apologized. YG has not. this thread was about YG. not about the riots.
korean people long before that had an attitude of fear when they associated with black people. so don’t try to make it like because of ice cubes song all the chaos erupted. there was tension between the black community and the korean community long before that and you know it. so just stop reaching.
well actually, one study showed that the more interaction there was between koreans and blacks, the more those negative stereotypes faded away. it was in communities without much contact with each other that the stereotypes existed the strongest. this is in general. but yeah, there was tension of course. but yeah, if someone hit me 4 times in teh face and knocked me out, i would be pretty pissed. i’ve challenged a cop to a fight before, (after his shift ends) lol. there are people with tempers, and some of them are korean. thats the way life is. honestly, maybe its from growing up in LA, but i swear, most of the homicides here in LA, is because of disrespect. not money, or greed, or crap like that. its from disrespect. at least, thats what it seems like.
(LucasBunny @ Apr 9 2007, 11:35 AM) *
Omg no said the song wasnt racist!If u read through no one is justifying the song
but what ur not understanding is this is not about the LA riots or Ice Cube
it’s about what happened with Suengri.Stop being a selective reader rahrah!
uh… if u are 50% selective. I will be 100000 % selective.
(clockwatcher @ Apr 9 2007, 12:33 PM) *
rahrah,
This is how it goes. It appears that you’ve been bringing up all sorts of things to try to justify racism. In this thread, you’ve mentioned college admission policies, rape/prostitution (in the Xenophobia discussion), Black Korea and the LA riots at different points when the issue is some artist making an ignorant comment about getting shot by a black person. That’s why this discussion is turning into an LA riots discussion because you keep bringing it up as some sort of justification for Korean prejudice against African Americans and not because no one wants to admit that Black Korea is wrong.A lot of people who’ve never met a black person, who know nothing about the LA riots are racist towards black people. A lot of people who have nothing to do with slavery etc are racist towards black people and vice versa. So I don’t even understand why you’re bringing up slavery/black-white issues and what not. So what is your explanation for Koreans who are racist towards Indians and vice versa? Again, you’re bringing another irrelevant issue into this.
If someone goes into a store and gets followed and watched the entire time, if they feel any tension towards the storekeeper, trust me, it’s not about any damn slavery. Apparently, this happened in many stores prior to the LA riots so if there was any tension between blacks and Koreans it might have something to do with that. And probably for other reasons as well. And it’s not about having any prior history but how the two communities treat and regard one another in current time. I am not saying that there weren’t any Korean stores that got robbed by black people or anything, either. And I’m not saying that people didn’t bring along any prior prejudice they already had against black people when they initially immigrated.
I mean, you’re still trying to justify that lady killing that girl by talking about women’s irrational temper (now you’re getting sexist) and what not.
The Black Korea song was racist. No doubt about it. It was provoked by what he felt was a racist incident, but in and of itself, it was racist. But what does that have do to with what Seung Ri or whomever said? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
ay u guys said all i wanted u to say. ice cube’s song was racist and wrong. his song was a call to war. not an ignorant innocent comment. it was a calculated call to unite blacks against koreans and to bring fire and destruction on all koreans. ur right, his thing was 100203920-3920x worse than big bang or whover.
anyways, i hope u guys get an apology or a better letter from the management/the guy himself but i doubt it. ice cube only apologized bc he was gonna lose endorsements. this guy, whoever he is, he doesn’t have american endorsers. in a way, that letter was very honest, bc if he had american endorsements and advertisers, then u guys would have a better chance of getting an apology.
if i was his management, i would just have written a sorry letter, it won’t happen again, and given free VIP tickets to some concert in the future. but anyways, sometimes, some koreans have tempers and can say things a little too honestly than what westerners are used to. but they could have at least been much more warm hearted and apologetic in the letter tho.
rahrah
Apr 9 2007, 06:56 PM
btw, what i suggest is writing a letter to the management that says that you are fans of big boy, and that u know u are not the typical demographic, but u have been his fan even if it meant that u are different from other blacks, thats how much of a fan u are. u don’t want to ruin his career, all u want is to feel better about what he said, because now when u hear his songs, u can’t stop thinking about his racist comment and that it hurts u to think that he might not be willing to sign an autograph just bc u are black. dont’ be too angry and don’t threaten them. just talk about how much u are personally hurt inside ur heart and u just want that wound to heal thats all.
have it all translated to korean by someone u know, send them that letter, and im sure things will work out.
LucasBunny
Apr 10 2007, 12:00 AM
(rahrah @ Apr 9 2007, 04:56 PM) *
btw, what i suggest is writing a letter to the management that says that you are fans of big boy, and that u know u are not the typical demographic, but u have been his fan even if it meant that u are different from other blacks, thats how much of a fan u are. u don’t want to ruin his career, all u want is to feel better about what he said, because now when u hear his songs, u can’t stop thinking about his racist comment and that it hurts u to think that he might not be willing to sign an autograph just bc u are black. dont’ be too angry and don’t threaten them. just talk about how much u are personally hurt inside ur heart and u just want that wound to heal thats all.have it all translated to korean by someone u know, send them that letter, and im sure things will work out.
I really do not think u understand what is going on!
You really do not get anything being talked about here
even though people have explained it many times.
JuicyFruit21
Apr 10 2007, 12:14 AM
(rahrah @ Apr 9 2007, 06:56 PM) *
btw, what i suggest is writing a letter to the management that says that you are fans of big boy, and that u know u are not the typical demographic, but u have been his fan even if it meant that u are different from other blacks, thats how much of a fan u are. u don’t want to ruin his career, all u want is to feel better about what he said, because now when u hear his songs, u can’t stop thinking about his racist comment and that it hurts u to think that he might not be willing to sign an autograph just bc u are black. dont’ be too angry and don’t threaten them. just talk about how much u are personally hurt inside ur heart and u just want that wound to heal thats all.have it all translated to korean by someone u know, send them that letter, and im sure things will work out.
lol um..yeah….we did that…..and we’re still waiting for an official reply from them.
if you want to read the letters just click #3 in my siggy, or go to Sophia’s Blog : http://ygfamily.blogspot.com or go to the YG main community board: http://www.ygfamily.com
we’ve been doing that from the start. it’s just some people don’t see that…all they see is ”attacking” and other malarky. nobody’s threatened anybody…nor has anybody stated they want his career ruined…
rahrah
Apr 10 2007, 12:47 AM
(JuicyFruit21 @ Apr 9 2007, 09:14 PM) *
lol um..yeah….we did that…..and we’re still waiting for an official reply from them.if you want to read the letters just click #3 in my siggy, or go to Sophia’s Blog : http://ygfamily.blogspot.com or go to the YG main community board: http://www.ygfamily.com
we’ve been doing that from the start. it’s just some people don’t see that…all they see is ”attacking” and other malarky. nobody’s threatened anybody…nor has anybody stated they want his career ruined…
eh too much drama for me as i read the stuff…but okay. good luck.
Do you live in the States? If you do, then you would know that show programs do not contains racism, words or acts about Asia
LOL what a bunch of bullshiet. I have yet to see an american movie released in teh past 6 years that did not have a single negative reference to asians. esp. in terms of asian women=whores etc… never mind the HOT97 tsunami song.
but anyways, i don’t want to really talk about that. good luck.
angelxglo
Apr 10 2007, 01:08 AM
i actually remember seungri’s remark and i also remember the posts you made in regards to seungri’s incident and of masta wu’s incident.
with seungri’s incident, i believe it was uncalled for and yes, it was really ignorant of seungri to say such a harmful thing. i guess i’m a big fan of big bang thats why i’m trying to defend seungri? i mean, the boy is 15, he’s STILL into Nsync for gawd sake. if anything, he probably has never even seen a real life black person before in his whole daym life. the only time he saw african american on TV was probably on tv, and tv doesnt exactly bring out the best of people. on top of that, many asian countries have never seen blacks in real life, they only heard stories and portrayles of how blacks act on tv, hence the sterotypes asians in asia have. But, its true that big bang is under YG, and YG promotes R&B and HipHop, and those type of music is in the african american culture, but if you really think about it, how many of them has actually interacted with black people? seungri was ignorant for saying that, you have to right to be angry. BUT, you cant demand that he apologize to yu directly because at that time, he was saying how he was feeling. it was freedom of expression. i’m sure years down the road, when he gets more experience he’ll be like “wtf? i cant believe i said that. i’m such a moron.” but right now, he’s still a kid.. let it go.. at least just this once.
as for the masta wu incident. i remember you were boycotting YG for this. i’m not exactly sure if yu still are… but… i noe the “N” word bugs alot of people. but the word has been soo overly used for so many years that it has lost most of its meaning. just like the word “pinkberry” before when you call a person “pinkberry” that person would probably want to fight you but now, when yu use it, yu brush it off. the “N” word is used by soo many R&B, hiphop and Rap artists in america. i remember yu said thats why you dunt listen to american hiphop. but what right do yu have to demand YG to apologize to you for using the “N” word if soo many others are using it also? if you want people to stop using that word, you have to start with the rap and hiphop artists at home because they are the ones influencing those overseas. i remember there was this episode on “girlfriends” about that issue (i love that show lols) i noticed that masta wu come to america alot he should noe that people are sensitive about the issue. i think he could’ve avoided using that word. why he didnt? i dunt noe. but the album itself in my opinon was pretty bad.
tian`tian
Apr 10 2007, 01:22 AM
(JuicyFruit21 @ Apr 8 2007, 03:47 PM) *
um..i’ve never heard an R&B song that glorified gang life….rap yes..r&b..not so much…also everybody tries to say music is to blame for X person’s actions..what ever happened to being responsible for yourself. it’s like the blame game. it happend with Marilyn Manson, Ozzy Osbourne… and even in this thread with Ice Cube..like wtf. take responsibility for your self and your actions…regardless if the consequences are good or bad. (i’m not just directing this at Seungri either..this is for everybody, myself included)
i feel what ash is tryna say. for him to emulate and ‘’study” black culture from his style of dress, all the way down to the slang he speaks, you’d think that he’d have enough common sense to know that black people arent the only people out there who would shoot someone. as for the stereotypes enforcing his way of thinking…if he really feels that way, and still acts and dresses the way he does..then he’s a poser and a fake. sorta a malibu’s most wanted thing, don’t you think? or maybe a vanilla ice? whatever.
i mean it’s ok for him to dress how he wants and act how he wants, but i think it’s a bit grimy and ironic for him to think that way about the people he’s biting his style from.
and i still think he should apologize(or his company) but like i said before……
I see it more as you take what you like from it, you leave what you don’t. It happens with everything. Tons of people love Chinese food. Does that mean that automatically dispels all the stereotypes and racist comments that they will make? No.
I’m also wondering, since I don’t know much about this Seungri person or Big Bang or…whatever, how did he say it? Was it in an interview or did someone just randomly catch it on tape?
EDIT: Oh yeah and with the take responsibility for your own actions thing. Well, when you come from a homogeneous nation of all Korean people, you don’t really have much else to go on besides what you hear/see from music/tv/movies/etc. when it comes to other ethnicities. Which is why I brought up earlier how my cousin who is around the age of 15/16 as well has complete stereotypes of Caucasian Americans being exactly like American Pie. Wrong? Yes. But it’s hard to expect them to fully understand all the aspects of how stereotypes and what they see in the media is not fully correct, when that is pretty much all they have to “tell” them what other ethnicities are like.
JuicyFruit21
Apr 10 2007, 10:12 AM
(angelxglo @ Apr 10 2007, 01:08 AM) *
i actually remember seungri’s remark and i also remember the posts you made in regards to seungri’s incident and of masta wu’s incident.with seungri’s incident, i believe it was uncalled for and yes, it was really ignorant of seungri to say such a harmful thing. i guess i’m a big fan of big bang thats why i’m trying to defend seungri? i mean, the boy is 15, he’s STILL into Nsync for gawd sake. if anything, he probably has never even seen a real life black person before in his whole daym life. the only time he saw african american on TV was probably on tv, and tv doesnt exactly bring out the best of people. on top of that, many asian countries have never seen blacks in real life, they only heard stories and portrayles of how blacks act on tv, hence the sterotypes asians in asia have. But, its true that big bang is under YG, and YG promotes R&B and HipHop, and those type of music is in the african american culture, but if you really think about it, how many of them has actually interacted with black people? seungri was ignorant for saying that, you have to right to be angry. BUT, you cant demand that he apologize to yu directly because at that time, he was saying how he was feeling. it was freedom of expression. i’m sure years down the road, when he gets more experience he’ll be like “wtf? i cant believe i said that. i’m such a moron.” but right now, he’s still a kid.. let it go.. at least just this once.
as for the masta wu incident. i remember you were boycotting YG for this. i’m not exactly sure if yu still are… but… i noe the “N” word bugs alot of people. but the word has been soo overly used for so many years that it has lost most of its meaning. just like the word “pinkberry” before when you call a person “pinkberry” that person would probably want to fight you but now, when yu use it, yu brush it off. the “N” word is used by soo many R&B, hiphop and Rap artists in america. i remember yu said thats why you dunt listen to american hiphop. but what right do yu have to demand YG to apologize to you for using the “N” word if soo many others are using it also? if you want people to stop using that word, you have to start with the rap and hiphop artists at home because they are the ones influencing those overseas. i remember there was this episode on “girlfriends” about that issue (i love that show lols) i noticed that masta wu come to america alot he should noe that people are sensitive about the issue. i think he could’ve avoided using that word. why he didnt? i dunt noe. but the album itself in my opinon was pretty bad.
INTRUDER WAIT TILL YOU ARE 20.
altho i shouldn’t be responding to you…yes he has met black people. hello he works with black people.
when did i say i was boycotting YG?!
and we weren’t angry when he first said it…well i wasn’t. the anger came about when certain people started telling us to shut up, ”get over it” and started accusing us of ”trying to end his career” and telling us pretty much that since we arent korean, then we don’t matter.
also the ”right” i have for asking for an apology is he disrespected me, as a black person. also, i hate when people say ‘’since US rappers say it, it’s ok for us to say it” no. its not. Eminem is a highly acclaimed rapper. he’s from america. he KNOWS even tho he does black music and is accepted by the black community there is a line he cannot cross. when that tape of him when he was younger rapping and saying the n word in his rhyme came out he apologized because he KNEW it was wrong. no matter how ”down” you are, it’s not ok.
and if you’re gonna use that logic of monkey see monkey do, then i guess it’s ok for rapists and killers to keep doing what they do because the news channels love to report that stuff..and well since so many others do it, its all gravy right? please. get real.
(tian`tian @ Apr 10 2007, 01:22 AM) *
I see it more as you take what you like from it, you leave what you don’t. It happens with everything. Tons of people love Chinese food. Does that mean that automatically dispels all the stereotypes and racist comments that they will make? No.I’m also wondering, since I don’t know much about this Seungri person or Big Bang or…whatever, how did he say it? Was it in an interview or did someone just randomly catch it on tape?
EDIT: Oh yeah and with the take responsibility for your own actions thing. Well, when you come from a homogeneous nation of all Korean people, you don’t really have much else to go on besides what you hear/see from music/tv/movies/etc. when it comes to other ethnicities. Which is why I brought up earlier how my cousin who is around the age of 15/16 as well has complete stereotypes of Caucasian Americans being exactly like American Pie. Wrong? Yes. But it’s hard to expect them to fully understand all the aspects of how stereotypes and what they see in the media is not fully correct, when that is pretty much all they have to “tell” them what other ethnicities are like.
you can’t compare liking food to this instance. he’s singing, dressing, talking in a way that reflects Black culture..he’s getting paid to do this.
now if you were to say that a famous Chef of Chinese Cuisine, then that’s different. but food preference is irrelevant…just because one likes spaghetti doesn’t mean they have to know about Italians. but if one is getting paid to represent Italian culture, do you think it would be right for them to assume that all Italians are mobsters and mob bosses who will blackmail and or kill you? because well since that’s in movies and tv, i guess its ok then right?
that would be like me saying some ignorant stereotypical stuff about Koreans as i wear a hanbok banging away on my Buk as i get paid for doing so….um HELLO?! lol
and when he said it, it was on Tablo’s radio show. they were being interviewed about their trip to NY.
yes i understand about the homogeneous-ness (yeah i made up a word) of Korea. being ignorant about certain cultures/things is not a crime. nobody said he should innately know how/what to think. it’s the fact that when corrected, or having his mistakes pointed out, it was ignored as if it didn’t happen…which seems to happen a lot. (the ignoring part) so that is were the issue lies..not with him making the mistake of stereotyping, but his(or rather his management) acting as if they don’t know after they’ve been made aware.
i hope you understand what i’m saying…because i’m not taking what i like and leaving what i dont.
cindel25
Apr 10 2007, 11:33 AM
angelxglo, your post is bullshit. Let me make this real clear to you. YG knows about the situation. They have yet to issue an apology. We have a right as YG fans to get an apology as Seungri disrespected his audience when making that ignorant comment.
This incident and the aftermath shows the incapability of YG to prepare their artists. God forbid Se7en should say something…
rahrah
Apr 10 2007, 12:15 PM
i’d just like to say, the spaghetti comment.
italians stole spaghetti and pasta from noodles in asia, but italians make fun of asians all the time. while eating spaghetti.
there are a lot of racist people who do things with bad intentions. i remember there was a story of a white cop police chief in lousiana, who said he won’t hire any “gooks”. and he was married to a japanese woman.
stereotypes exist all the time esp. for blacks and asians and other minorities. i mean, if a black dood said “yeah, when i sat down for the math test, everyone there was asian! i knew the curve was gonna be screwed!” its stereotypical and somewhat offensive, but there is no bad intention behind it. i think intention is more important.
LucasBunny
Apr 10 2007, 02:07 PM
(rahrah @ Apr 10 2007, 10:15 AM) *
i’d just like to say, the spaghetti comment.italians stole spaghetti and pasta from noodles in asia, but italians make fun of asians all the time. while eating spaghetti.
there are a lot of racist people who do things with bad intentions. i remember there was a story of a white cop police chief in lousiana, who said he won’t hire any “gooks”. and he was married to a japanese woman.
stereotypes exist all the time esp. for blacks and asians and other minorities. i mean, if a black dood said “yeah, when i sat down for the math test, everyone there was asian! i knew the curve was gonna be screwed!” its stereotypical and somewhat offensive, but there is no bad intention behind it. i think intention is more important.
Do u really want to get into issues of other countries stealing things and claiming it as there own???
…..Nope not even going to get into it.
And yes we are well aware of stereotypes existing all the time
but I think you are still missing the point of the discussion dude
JuicyFruit21
Apr 10 2007, 02:19 PM
(rahrah @ Apr 10 2007, 12:15 PM) *
i’d just like to say, the spaghetti comment.italians stole spaghetti and pasta from noodles in asia, but italians make fun of asians all the time. while eating spaghetti.
there are a lot of racist people who do things with bad intentions. i remember there was a story of a white cop police chief in lousiana, who said he won’t hire any “gooks”. and he was married to a japanese woman.
stereotypes exist all the time esp. for blacks and asians and other minorities. i mean, if a black dood said “yeah, when i sat down for the math test, everyone there was asian! i knew the curve was gonna be screwed!” its stereotypical and somewhat offensive, but there is no bad intention behind it. i think intention is more important.
yes but the point of the spaghetti comment was you cant compare food preference to someones job.
someone getting paid to practically be black in essence and making stereotypical remarks vs someone who eats a type of food making remarks is different. not that the stereotypical remarks from the eating person are any less offensive.but i hope you see what i’m tryna say.
i can eat pasta or tacos or sushi or kimchi all my damn life and not have to know about the culture they derived from. why? because it’s just food. most people when they go out for say, Greek food, they don’t care about the Greek people to the point of learning their culture…to them it’s just a night of fun and different food…it’s not their job. they dont have to know. it would make the dining experience more fun and memorable, but they dont. have. to. know.
but if i’m getting paid to do Kabuki, or getting paid to perform traditional West African Dance, or getting paid to sing Bachata music, don’t you think, as a professional it would make sense that i know about Japanese, West African or Dominican culture that i’m famous for doing???. i mean that just comes with the territory.
and if intention is more important what about if even tho he didn’t mean to be offensive, his comments help fester the thought that black people are all violent and bad and white people are what’s right ? …because you do know that’s inadvertently what he did. subconsciously that’s the message he sent.
so it’s alright if, when this false generalization is made aware to his management, that he not apologize to the fans he disrespected and to the other fans he misguided? because a lot of young Korean teenagers in Korea look up to them…and what they say has influence. like it or not.
if they black guy said that, and was made aware of how this is offensive and how it could hurt peoples feelings then i’d fully expect for him to apologize. it’s not that complicated as you try to make it.
here he is a celebrity. saying things that are hurtful to his fans he should apologize. regardless of the fact that we are in the minority of his fanbase.
just recently Mr. Imus apologized for what he said. everybody agreed he was wrong for saying that, and he acknowledged his mistake. why is it so hard for the those in charge of things over @ YG to acknowledge this mistake? especially when they are trying to come to the US and win new fans….doing a genre of music that is created by the people they’re stereotyping against.
BoSoxdirtdog
Apr 10 2007, 02:42 PM
(rahrah @ Apr 10 2007, 12:15 PM) *
italians stole spaghetti and pasta from noodles in asia, but italians make fun of asians all the time. while eating spaghetti.
Awesome! Unintended comedy at its best!
rahrah
Apr 10 2007, 02:56 PM
(BoSoxdirtdog @ Apr 10 2007, 11:42 AM) *
Awesome! Unintended comedy at its best!
lolz how do u know it was unintended? lol
(JuicyFruit21 @ Apr 10 2007, 11:19 AM) *
and if intention is more important what about if even tho he didn’t mean to be offensive, his comments help fester the thought that black people are all violent and bad and white people are what’s right ? …because you do know that’s inadvertently what he did. subconsciously that’s the message he sent.
yeah, he did spread stereotypes. ur right. its wrong and he would have apologized already if he had american endorsers.
btw, those images are pretty pervasive in asia. i heard about africans (straight from africa) who visit japan, and dress in american style hip hop clothing, and try to pass off as african american rappers. LOL
i never seen a dood act like william hung on purpose.
Aziraphale
Apr 10 2007, 02:57 PM
(rahrah @ Apr 10 2007, 06:15 PM) *
i’d just like to say, the spaghetti comment.italians stole spaghetti and pasta from noodles in asia, but italians make fun of asians all the time. while eating spaghetti.
Last checked, this isn’t the food forum.
I’m warning all of you, stick to the topic and don’t make irrelevant assumptions that have nothing to do with the discussion at hand. Another post about food and you can all go camp out in the food forum while I close this thread.
rahrah
Apr 10 2007, 03:12 PM
also, during the world cup, koreans were pretty warm hearted to Togo, because of the suffering and hardship Togo had to go thru to get to the World Cup and also their history of colonization under France. There are African cultural centers in Korea (African, not African American), and also, one of the founders of the Black Panther’s was an Asian American Richard Aoki. I just hope that ur anger is balanced with another view of what is out there as well.
i mean, yeah black panther’s have never said anything bad about asian americans tho. but yeah hip hop today does spread bad stereotypes about blacks. its not like the 90’s anymore, when it was more political and refreshing. oh wells.
clockwatcher
Apr 11 2007, 07:38 PM
What does Korea being warm hearted to Togo have to do with Seungri making a comment about being happy that he didn’t enter a black guy’s car otherwise he’d have been shot?
JuicyFruit21
Apr 11 2007, 08:06 PM
(clockwatcher @ Apr 11 2007, 07:38 PM) *
What does Korea being warm hearted to Togo have to do with Seungri making a comment about being happy that he didn’t enter a black guy’s car otherwise he’d have been shot?
nothing just like the majority of his posts..lol sorry rahrah, but you are like…all over the place….lol only about a third of your posts have been on topic…ph34r.gif
rahrah
Apr 12 2007, 12:03 AM
ahhh so it was new york city he went to???? then he’s obviously heard of all the shootings of chinese deliverymen in the ghettoes. i think like 10 chinese doods died last year. usually over like 10 bucks.
whats more troublesome isn’t that guy’s comments, but the negative stereotypes that many blacks have of asians in nyc that lead to murder.
http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?s…1&aid=58398
Officers answering a 911 call found 46-year-old Shi Wi Yan shot in the chest. He was rushed to Mary Immaculate Hospital in critical condition, where he remains Thursday.
“It was unbelievable, because he is such a nice guy,” says Cindy Wong, a fellow employee at Cheung Hing Kitchen on Hollis Avenue.
Investigators believe this attack is part of a pattern of delivery robberies in the neighborhood.3 sought in Qns. deliveryman slay
BY ERNIE NASPRETTO
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERDetectives were searching yesterday for three assailants who allegedly stabbed a Chinese immigrant to death in Queens.
Friends said Hungqi Zhang, 40, immigrated to the U.S. five years ago, and was supporting a wife and teenage daughter in China by working as a restaurant deliveryman on the upper East Side.Zhang was attacked at the corner of Elder Ave. and Colden St. early Sunday after leaving a celebration in Flushing marking the Chinese New Year.
“He would leave the house around 9 in the morning and come home around midnight,” said landlord Yufang Zhang at the victim’s Holly Ave. home in Flushing. “He worked very hard and was a very nice man.”
Police could only describe the attackers as three black men between the ages of 18 and 20. They were last seen fleeing south on Colden St. after the stabbing.
“We don’t know if robbery was the initial motive, but they did take [Zhang's] cell phone,” said a police source.
Police said they are questioning the account given by people in the group that left the party with Zhang. Members of the group said they walked ahead of Zhang by almost a half-block, but police think they were much closer to the fatal scene.
Cops also said they have no reason to believe the crime was racially motivated. Residents of the area who were awakened by men yelling at each other and members of the group with Zhang said they did not hear any racial remarks.
Anyone with information is urged to call the Crime Stoppers hotline at (800) 577-TIPS. All calls are kept confidential.
Originally published on February 20, 2007
if u want me to be relevant, i can look for about 5 other articles like this that also talk about it in queens. the disturbing thing is that it seems chinese were targeted specifically, and that they were killed after being robbed of like 10 bucks usually.
anyways, the guy doesn’t live in america. he is 15 years old. if he was older and he lived in america, then obviously his comment would be very wrong. maybe he had a certain impression of new york and potentially being targeted for a robbery bc he was asian. not that big of a deal considering he doesn’t live in america.
JuicyFruit21
Apr 12 2007, 12:30 AM
^^ again. what do those chinese men have to do with Seungri? ( not to take any thing away from the severity and inhumanity of those crimes) but
dude you are soooo missing the point. as you said, Seungri doesn’t live in America. and being that he’s from S.Korea, i highly doubt news about what happens to Chinese Americans makes it to him.
what we were discussing has to do with him NOT APOLOGIZING after making stereotypes about black people, after he’s worked with, and knows of his black fans. we understand that he made a mistake because he’s a child. our issue is with being ignored and treated as if our feelings don’t count because of our nationality/race.
please try to keep up and stay on same page as the rest of the class.
you are so…… weird…seriously..it’s like your arguments make sense and then all of a sudden out of left field you start talking about how meter maids aren’t fair to people who drive expensive cars in Tabago because there’s a news article in Russia about ppl with expensive cars being racist!? blink.gif
lol rahrah…*shakes head*
rahrah
Apr 12 2007, 12:41 AM
^ well, i wouldn’t want to live in queens after i hear of how asians get treated there.
but then again, i hear italians, and most other races attacking asians in nyc as well. as much as i would like to say, they are targeting chinese, not koreans. i don’t think ignorant racist fools care about the difference.
LucasBunny
Apr 12 2007, 12:43 AM
(rahrah @ Apr 11 2007, 10:03 PM) *
ahhh so it was new york city he went to???? then he’s obviously heard of all the shootings of chinese deliverymen in the ghettoes. i think like 10 chinese doods died last year. usually over like 10 bucks.whats more troublesome isn’t that guy’s comments, but the negative stereotypes that many blacks have of asians in nyc that lead to murder.
http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?s…1&aid=58398
if u want me to be relevant, i can look for about 5 other articles like this that also talk about it in queens. the disturbing thing is that it seems chinese were targeted specifically, and that they were killed after being robbed of like 10 bucks usually.
anyways, the guy doesn’t live in america. he is 15 years old. if he was older and he lived in america, then obviously his comment would be very wrong. maybe he had a certain impression of new york and potentially being targeted for a robbery bc he was asian. not that big of a deal considering he doesn’t live in america.
Jesus!
Have u been reading anything???
This has nothing to do with Suengri not apologizing!
You keep going way off topic!
It is a big deal to us as his black fans
because he looked us right in our faces and smiled at MTV, his whole get up is based on our culture. He as well as the rest of Big Bang are aware that they have african american fans and he should have known better than to make an ignorant comment.
This is about Suengri’s ignorant comment!
Not about Chinese delivery men getting shot!
So u can get on with those articles your posting.
rahrah
Apr 12 2007, 12:48 AM
^ actually, since it was in NYC, the way asians get treated in nyc is pretty relevant to this discussion. but it does seem like about 70% of the cases i hear in NYC are from black assailing chinese, while 30% are italians and other races assailing chinese.
i honestly don’t think it would have been different if it was a korean person tho.
but i guess as long as it is NYC, there is somewhat of an equal chance that an italian or black guy will kill u for no reason other than racism. lolz
jurassic5
Apr 12 2007, 10:40 AM
(rahrah @ Apr 12 2007, 12:48 AM) *
^ actually, since it was in NYC, the way asians get treated in nyc is pretty relevant to this discussion. but it does seem like about 70% of the cases i hear in NYC are from black assailing chinese, while 30% are italians and other races assailing chinese.i honestly don’t think it would have been different if it was a korean person tho.
but i guess as long as it is NYC, there is somewhat of an equal chance that an italian or black guy will kill u for no reason other than racism. lolz
rahrah…are you sure you wanna leave this post up? because….WOW. *shakes head*
clockwatcher
Apr 12 2007, 11:06 AM
I see… so we’ve finally gotten to the bottom of it. It seems that at the end of the day, rahrah agrees with Seungri. Moving on…
cindel25
Apr 12 2007, 11:10 AM
(rahrah @ Apr 12 2007, 12:48 AM) *
^ actually, since it was in NYC, the way asians get treated in nyc is pretty relevant to this discussion. but it does seem like about 70% of the cases i hear in NYC are from black assailing chinese, while 30% are italians and other races assailing chinese.i honestly don’t think it would have been different if it was a korean person tho.
but i guess as long as it is NYC, there is somewhat of an equal chance that an italian or black guy will kill u for no reason other than racism. lolz
You are a sociopath. WTF does this have to do with this discussion?
I get it now; You agree with Seungri’s comments.
You know you could have just said that at the beginning and spare us the Bullshit. All this talk about food, Korean shop owners, ice cube etc etc; I’m still waiting for you to incorporate the Amish and Space Aliens into this.
rahrah
Apr 12 2007, 12:24 PM
Here is more incidents regarding New York. Like I said, it seems likely that a white male and a black male are both likely to be responsible for anti Asian hate crimes. I don’t think you guys understand how serious anti Asian hate crimes are in New York.
One month ago in New York
3/18/07 New York Post: “Girl’s Bloody Beating. Driver Does Nothing As Teens Attack Her On Bus,â€
March 18, 2007 — A Catholic-high-school student said she was brutally punched, kicked and teased for looking “Chinese” by a pack of kids as she rode a city bus home from school – and claims the bus driver did nothing except tell her to “go to a priest.”
two months ago in Queens New York
QUOTE
1/18/07 New York Daily News:
Cop’s son pleads guilty to hate attack on Queens men
by Scott Shifrel
A police officer’s son who beat up two Chinese-American men in a racist
attack that outraged community leaders pleaded guilty to assault as a hate
crime yesterday.
Late last year in Queens New York
8/15/06 New York Times: “Accusations of a Hate Crime Expose Tensions,â€
By Michelle O’Donnell
An attack on four Asian-American men in Douglaston, Queens, that prosecutors
are calling a hate crime has opened a breach in the unsteady truce between the neighborhood’s mostly white population and the prospering Chinese and Korean immigrants who have moved to the area in recent years, residents said yesterday.
Late last year in Queens New York
8/15/06 WCBS TV NY wcbstv.com: “Alleged Hate Crime Victim: I Was So Defenseless; Reynold Liang Recounts Vicious Attack He Suffered Through,â€
(AP) Queens. An Asian man injured in what authorities are calling a hate crime said he was more infuriated than scared by the attack despite the numerous times he was hit.11/14/05 Fort Wayne Journal Gazzette (AP): “Slurs, beatings against Asian students on the rise,â€
By Erin Texeira
Associated Press
New York – Eighteen-year-old Chen Tsu was waiting on a Brooklyn subway platform after school when four high school classmates approached him and demanded cash. He showed them his empty pockets, but they attacked him anyway, taking turns pummeling his face.
He was scared and injured – bruised and swollen for several days – but hardly surprised.7/20/05 New York Newsday: “Arraignment and guilty plea in murder of Chinese
food deliveryman,â€
by Herbert Lowe
A Queens teenager pleaded guilty Tuesday to murder and robbery charges in
the savage death of a Chinese food deliveryman, while a long-suspected
accomplice was arraigned on murder charges in the same case.3/6/05 New York Daily News: “Asian community unites at trial: Rip attacks on deliverymen,â€
by Scott Shifrel
The attack left Huang Chen’s face nearly unrecognizable.
The 18-year-old was viciously pummeled and then stabbed to death as he delivered a $10 order of Chinese food – allegedly so the assailants could get enough money for a pair of Nikes, cops said.Assaults vicious and deadly
July 18, 2003: Li Zhen Lin, 25, a worker at the Beautiful Garden restaurant in Far Rockaway, Queens , was shot and killed during a robbery.
Oct. 15, 2002: Jian Chun Lin, 36, delivering for Happy House restaurant, was shot and killed in the lobby of a Brownsville building.
March 20, 2001: Wu-Ching Wang, 51, who worked at the New Cheung Hing Restaurant near Chinatown , was beaten with a baseball bat. He survived.
Sept. 1, 2000: Jin-Sheng Liu, 44, owner of Golden Wok Chinese Restaurant in St. Albans, Queens , was pummeled to death with bricks by five teens as he delivered food to a deserted house.Asian leaders from as far as Chicago have showed up to support the Chens and to protest a series of attacks in recent years on Asian food workers. Rallies outside the courthouse didn’t stop even after Queens Supreme Court Justice Robert Hanophy warned against them.
“The community is very concerned because we feel like Asians are being targeted,” said York Chan, who heads the Chinese Consolidated Benevolent Association, a Manhattan-based coalition of 60 groups.
“These workers mind their own business and work hard and try to make a living, and they get murdered for such nonsense. We want to see a heavy sentence to send a message.”
Btw, to everyone who thinks that Anti Asian hate crime in New York is worthy of ignoring and glossing over, here is a quote from a New York City councilman.
“The first step toward curing this racist hate is admitting it,” said
Councilman John Liu (D-Flushing).
So please, admitting it exists, is the best way to help cure anti Asian hate crime in New York City. Lets not ignore this any further.
So if you look at the cases, it looks like that whites and blacks will both be likely to attack Asians in New York specifically Queens New York with anti Asian hate criminal intent. So yeah, he should have been scared of both. Not one more than the other, when you look at the evidence of anti Asian hate crimes in New York.
Here is the racial makeup of Queens New York:
White 44%
Black 20%
Hispanic 25%
Asian 18%
JuicyFruit21
Apr 12 2007, 12:48 PM
(rahrah @ Apr 12 2007, 12:48 AM) *
^ actually, since it was in NYC, the way asians get treated in nyc is pretty relevant to this discussion. but it does seem like about 70% of the cases i hear in NYC are from black assailing chinese, while 30% are italians and other races assailing chinese.i honestly don’t think it would have been different if it was a korean person tho.
but i guess as long as it is NYC, there is somewhat of an equal chance that an italian or black guy will kill u for no reason other than racism. lolz
wow……lol u are impossible..and that’s not a compliment.
QUOTE(cindel25 @ Apr 12 2007, 11:10 AM) *
You are a sociopath. WTF does this have to do with this discussion?I get it now; You agree with Seungri’s comments.
You know you could have just said that at the beginning and spare us the B*****t. All this talk about food, Korean shop owners, ice cube etc etc; I’m still waiting for you to incorporate the Amish and Space Aliens into this.
PUAHAHAHAHA SOPHIA!! HUSH DON’T GIVE HIM IDEAS!!
(rahrah @ Apr 12 2007, 12:24 PM) *
Here is more incidents regarding New York. Like I said, it seems likely that a white male and a black male are both likely to be responsible for anti Asian hate crimes. I don’t think you guys understand how serious anti Asian hate crimes are in New York.One month ago in New York
two months ago in Queens New York
Late last year in Queens New York
Late last year in Queens New York
Btw, to everyone who thinks that Anti Asian hate crime in New York is worthy of ignoring and glossing over, here is a quote from a New York City councilman.
So please, admitting it exists, is the best way to help cure anti Asian hate crime in New York City. Lets not ignore this any further.So if you look at the cases, it looks like that whites and blacks will both be likely to attack Asians in New York specifically Queens New York with anti Asian hate criminal intent. So yeah, he should have been scared of both. Not one more than the other, when you look at the evidence of anti Asian hate crimes in New York.
Here is the racial makeup of Queens New York:
White 44%
Black 20%
Hispanic 25%
Asian 18%
yeah it’s quite obvious you don’t have a clue what we’re talking about……geeze…lmao. u are something.
clockwatcher
Apr 12 2007, 12:56 PM
lol… rahrah just can’t quit. Dude, we get your argument. You feel Seungri’s comments were justified. Now move the hell on.
BUT
What is the probability that an Asian person walking in NY will be a victim of race-based hate crime? Start off with that thinking before you start quoting news articles.
Mind you, you mention that Asians are likely to be attacked by both whites and blacks (although Seungri was happy he entered a white person’s van and not a black person’s so your pointless argument is even more pointless) but then if someone is victimized based on their race, wouldn’t it be by someone of another race? wacko.gif So you mention 3 other races and based on your anecdotal evidence and preconcieved notions, you mention 2 of those races. Is this really your argument?
But really, there’s no need to continue – your message is very loud and clear.
rahrah
Apr 12 2007, 01:32 PM
(clockwatcher @ Apr 12 2007, 09:56 AM) *
lol… rahrah just can’t quit. Dude, we get your argument. You feel Seungri’s comments were justified. Now move the hell on.BUT
What is the probability that an Asian person walking in NY will be a victim of race-based hate crime? Start off with that thinking before you start quoting news articles.
Mind you, you mention that Asians are likely to be attacked by both whites and blacks (although Seungri was happy he entered a white person’s van and not a black person’s so your pointless argument is even more pointless) but then if someone is victimized based on their race, wouldn’t it be by someone of another race? wacko.gif So you mention 3 other races and based on your anecdotal evidence and preconcieved notions, you mention 2 of those races. Is this really your argument?
But really, there’s no need to continue – your message is very loud and clear.
uh. u clearly didn’t read my posts. I said the anti Asian hate crime can be committed by both white or black. So that guy should have been scared of BOTH. Although, I will be happy to look at all the abnormally high rate of anti Asian hate crimes in NYC, and see which race is the main perpetrator percentage wise.
“The first step toward curing this racist hate is admitting it,” said
Councilman John Liu (D-Flushing).
clockwatcher
Apr 12 2007, 01:52 PM
Yeah, I skipped the bottom part of your post. But I think it’s hilarious that you are honestly trying to say that Seungri’s comment had anything to do with his belief that he’d be targeted for a hate crime.
jurassic5
Apr 12 2007, 02:22 PM
although a bit off-topic…this graphic may help with what has been discussed in the last few posts:
From Nov. 2006 Article
According to UPI, New York Police found crimes against Asians and Hispanics to be relatively low
rahrah
Apr 12 2007, 02:27 PM
^ that is very informative, although it does ignore the 2004-2006 period where most of the anti Asian hate crimes occured and the general difficulty and ambivalence there is to classifying anti asian hate crimes. there is much more attention focused on anti gay crimes than anti asian crimes in the mainstream media.
(clockwatcher @ Apr 12 2007, 10:52 AM) *
Yeah, I skipped the bottom part of your post. But I think it’s hilarious that you are honestly trying to say that Seungri’s comment had anything to do with his belief that he’d be targeted for a hate crime.
You can’t admit that there exists a significant amount of anti Asian racist hate in NYC? I really think you underestimate it.
In Los Angeles, anti Black hate crimes are up as well. It is well known what race a lot of the perpetrators are. and what neighborhoods might be dangerous for a black person just because the color of his/her skin. its more sad than anything because it is similiar to what is happening to asians in NYC. I would never deny it because denying it leads to nowhere.
if you want to learn more. read this article.
LA Racial Hate Crimes
I think its sad if anyone’s concerns are ignored, more importantly, if their concerns are fear for their life, because of racial hate crimes. That said, although I believe there is significant evidence in NYC to fear against anti Asian hate crimes, or robberies in general directed at Asians specifically because of stereotypes of being weak and submissive, I don’t think there is enough evidence to say that it will be more likely a black than white perpetrator. Although it should be explored.
clockwatcher
Apr 12 2007, 02:34 PM
(rahrah @ Apr 12 2007, 02:27 PM) *
You can’t admit that there exists a significant amount of anti Asian racist hate in NYC? I really think you underestimate it. You’re not Asian, so you wouldn’t know what it feels like.In Los Angeles, anti Black hate crimes are up as well. It is well known what race a lot of the perpetrators are. and what neighborhoods might be dangerous for a black person. its more sad than anything. I would never deny it because denying it leads to nowhere.
if you want to learn more. read this article.
LA Racial Hate Crimes
I think its sad if anyone’s concerns are ignored, more importantly, if their concerns are fear for their life, because of racial hate crimes.
I am not Asian but I am black so don’t try to tell me some B.S about “not knowing what it feels like.” Are you honestly kidding me? I have not been beaten but I’ve been spat at and insulted based on my race and let’s not talk about the usual stalking and other smaller ‘attacks.’ And the only ethnic/racial group I haven’t experienced any of this from are Native Americans.
So don’t come here with some story about hate crimes and try to use it to justify some singer’s racist comments.
And I’m from a foreign country so I already had preconceived notions of how people will act in both England and America (I’ve lived in both countries) and I was way off on some and right on others. And I did emigrate as a young teenager but I wasn’t stupid or racist enough to think that I could make a comment such as Seungri’s.
So just quit it.
melkimx
Apr 12 2007, 02:37 PM
^ seriously, don’t bother arguing with rahrah. he’s spent this entire thread (actually his entire tenure at soompi) either making absolutely no sense or making really offensive racist or sexist remarks. nothing anything you guys have written has actually gotten through to him, and nothing ever will.
jurassic5
Apr 12 2007, 02:46 PM
rahrah,
although it may be true that anti-asian hate crimes have increased in the last few years, i think what everyone (including myself) in this thread is trying to point out is that just because of these incidents, u can not make blanket statements as you have earlier in this thread. feel free to comment on the YG incident, but if wanna talk about anything else racial, i’d suggest doing in the thread dedicated to race and racial issues in the USA.
with that being said….let’s all get back on the original posters topic.
rahrah
Apr 12 2007, 02:56 PM
^ yeah I agree that making blanket statements doesn’t help in general. but the problem i have with his comment is that his feeling is not necessarily accurate and that he should have kept it to himself instead of blurting it out. but if a black person said the same thing about certain neighborhoods in LA, i think he/she would be justified.
(jurassic5 @ Apr 12 2007, 11:22 AM) *
From Nov. 2006 Article
Ynet
hmm… although i rather see the data myself, that is a very informative article. thanks.
i dug up some more figures about hate crimes.
Racial Bias
In 2005, law enforcement agencies reported that 4,691 hate crime offenses were racially motivated. Of these offenses:68.2 percent were triggered by anti-black bias.
19.9 percent were motivated by anti-white bias.
4.9 percent resulted from anti-Asian/Pacific Islander bias.
4.9 percent were driven by bias against groups of individuals in which more than one race was reported (anti-multiple races, group).
2.0 percent were motivated by anti-American Indian/Alaskan Native bias.http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/hc2005/incidentsoffenses.htm
QUOTE
By Race
An analysis of available race data for the 6,804 known hate crime offenders revealed that:60.5 percent were white.
19.9 percent were black.
12.3 percent were unknown.
5.2 percent were groups made up of individuals of various races (multiple races, group).
1.1 percent of known offenders were American Indian/Alaskan Native.
0.9 percent were Asian/Pacific Islander.http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/hc2005/offenders.htm
well anyways, from this evidence, it looks like blacks suffer from anti black hate crimes more than asians suffer from anti asian crimes as a whole. however asians, blacks, and native americans are overrepresented in hate crime victim statistics. kind of sad.
but anyways, i think its appropriate if they ever try to break into the US mainstream, to address this any sort of issues like this with facts than ignorance.
Aziraphale
Apr 12 2007, 03:56 PM
(rahrah)
^ yeah I agree that making blanket statements doesn’t help in general.
So why do you keep making them?
I believe the Seungri discussion has been exhausted, no thanks to rahrah, who insists on going off-topic despite being asked not to.
Further debate on racism should go into the Racism thread that jurassic5 has created.
Filed under: YG Family | 3 Comments
Banned in Korea
Orginial Korean Article:
힙합가수 마스타 우의 새 앨범이 부적절한 가사로 지상파로부터 무더기 방송불가 판정을 받았다.
15곡이 수록된 마스타 우 2집 ‘Brand Wu Year’는 KBS와 MBC, SBS 등 지상파 3사로부터 5곡이 방송부적합 판정을 받았다.
마 스타 우 소속사 YG 엔터테인먼트에 따르면 KBS심의실은 지난 23일 마스타 우 2집 수록곡중 ‘Do or Die’ ‘Funking Dead’ ‘싸가지’ ‘미스효리’ ‘서울’ 등 5곡에 대해 방송부적합 판정을 내렸고, MBC심의실은 ‘Funking Dead’와 ‘싸가지’에 대해 같은 판정을 내렸다.
이어 26일 SBS 심의실도 ‘Funking Dead’와 ‘싸가지’ ‘미스효리’에 대해 방송부적합 판정을 내렸따.
지상파 3사로부터 방송부적합 판정을 받은 곡들은 모두 욕설 등 방송에서 사용할 수 없는 가사로 인해 부적격 판정을 받았으며, ‘미스효리’ 같은 경우는 욕설은 없지만 특정인의 이름이 제목에 포함돼 방송불가 판정을 내렸다.
YG 엔터테인먼트의 한 관계자는 “이번 지상파 3사의 판정은 어느 정도 예상했던 일”이라며 “그러나 마스타 우가 그다지 많은 방송활동을 하지 않을 예정인데다, 이번에 방송부적합 판정을 받은 곡으로 방송활동을 계획하지 않아 재심의는 신청하지 않을 계획”이라고 밝혔다.
마스타 우는 시원한 금관악기와 현악기가 어우러진 빠른 비트의 ‘Don’t Stop’으로 활동을 시작한다.
credit: news daum
This is the translation of that article:
HipHop artist Masta Wu’s new album has been censored for inappropriate lyrics.
with the 15 tracks off his second album ‘Brand Wu Year’..broadcasting companies MBC, KBS and SBS have laid out a decision to ban 5 of those 15 tracks.
Backed by YG Entertainment, Masta Wu has KBS on the 23rd banning “Do or Die”, “Funking dead”, ‘싸가지’ ‘미스효리’ ‘서울’ from broadcast. MBC has done the same for “Funking dead” and ‘싸가지’ .
이어 26일 SBS 심의실도 ‘Funking Dead’와 ‘싸가지’ ‘미스효리’에 대해 방송부적합 판정을 내렸따.
On the 26th..SBS has laid down similar decisions for “Funking Dead” and ‘싸가지’ ‘미스효리’.For those songs…all three broadcast companies have decided the reason behind broadcast ban is due to the profanities at use in the lyrics. In the case for the song ‘미스효리’… {Something about how the name “hyori” is used so they can’t allow this sort of thing}
A YG Entertainment official has been quoted to say that “The decision that the aforementioned 3 Companies have declared does not come as a surprise”. “Masta Wu was not planned to be having TV promotion/broadcasts with all those songs anyway.” “The songs that were banned were not to be contracted for broadcast air beforehand and so we have no plans to argue against these decisions and or have them reevaluated”
Masta Wu has started promoting with a fresh new feel and contagious beat-ed track “Don’t stop”
credit: news daum
credit: tokyollvogue for translation
Filed under: YG Family | 2 Comments
Update!
Much Thanks and Major Props for our friend ‘cowisbig’ who posted this in the comments section.
cowisbig said…
hey cindel, what’s up.
I actually asked the webmaster of YG and there was a response. He/she said they are discussing the issue inside YG and apologized for the lateness in dealing with what’s going on but they are at least aware of what we are posting.
…
Filed under: YG Family | 1 Comment
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